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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
 Posted - 23/10/2013 : 13:08:32
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quote:
Originally posted by NancyB
Does this suggest that John Olsen was dead at this time, and Johan Bendik was out on his own although his older brother, Ole, was still at home? Betsy, if born in 1850, would be 15 in 1865--a little older than two 2 daughters listed.
Yes, since John is out of the house, if there is a Betsy in the family, it is possible that she is out of the house as well. You could test the theory in the 1865 census to see if she is listed elsewhere in the parish or not or in the country or not.
Or you could page backward from the posted link to John's baptism to the beginning of 1850 to see if she's there or forward to 1852 to see if she is there. These particular books are arranged alternately, a page of boy baptisms then a page of girl baptisms in baptism date order and so on.
One other thing is that Ole Johnsen and Randi are both born in a different parish than Levanger. If there is a Betsy born in the family, being a bit older than John may mean that she was born in the other parish as well. At least, if she is not found in Levanger parish baptisms, then you'd have to consider that.
It might be easier to search for potential Betsy confirmation since at the time roughly aged 14-16 years she is most likely in Levanger. Parents' names are usually given as part of the confirmation record, occasionally birth dates and places as well.
The question of geography re the Røros Betsy discussed before also brings a question here. Levanger is closer to Trondheim than to Bergen. If one was to go to the "big city" looking for work or opportunity it is more likely that someone coming from Levanger would go to Trondheim rather than Bergen. Of course, always exceptions exist.
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 23/10/2013 : 16:28:06
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quote:
Descendants sometimes have family stories that explain hard-to-crack mysteries (such as the birth family of Betsy Johnson).
Excellent point. These are almost certainly John and Martha's sons, John Olaf and Gideon, and worth pursuing. |
NancyB |
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 23/10/2013 : 16:32:38
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quote:
Yes, since John is out of the house, if there is a Betsy in the family, it is possible that she is out of the house as well. You could test the theory in the 1865 census to see if she is listed elsewhere in the parish or not or in the country or not.
Or you could page backward from the posted link to John's baptism to the beginning of 1850 to see if she's there or forward to 1852 to see if she is there. These particular books are arranged alternately, a page of boy baptisms then a page of girl baptisms in baptism date order and so on.
This should be easy enough for me to do since I have a starting point with the other baptism. Thank you for this suggestion! |
NancyB |
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 24/10/2013 : 06:21:14
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Can someone please tell me how to put a link in a message on here? I think I have located Martha Olsdatter, wife of Johan Bendik Johnson on a birth register. How can I say she's #85 and have the 85 link to the image or page?
Where I found her is on page 46 of Verdal (Stiklestad): 1852-1860, Parish register (official). But I'd sure like to know how to link like others do.
I would also eventually love to have someone transcribe the parents' names and the godparent's name that is a Johnson.
Thanks much!
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NancyB |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 24/10/2013 : 14:03:07
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There is a testing forum on this site to try out adding hyperlinks for practice if you want to do that.
I usually do a copy and paste of the heading information at the top of the page including the permanent pagelink. It includes the fylke, parish and book information important documentation. At the digitalarkivet parish registers the stuff in your browser window won't work as the address. The permanent page link is the only item that will and will last.
But I think I already posted Martha's baptism in an earlier post. |
Edited by - jkmarler on 24/10/2013 14:05:04 |
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 25/10/2013 : 00:28:22
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quote:
But I think I already posted Martha's baptism in an earlier post.
 Well, that is embarrassing! You are absolutely right, Jkmarler. And I even saved and printed that record when you posted it. But when I was putting together a quick pedigree chart, I overlooked that. On the plus side, it's good to know I can find something in the archives--even if I have trouble transcribing it.
On that particular record, I think I picked up her confirmation date (1 Oct 1871), but I'm at a loss for deciphering her mother's name. But, I may be getting too far off track anyway. |
NancyB |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 25/10/2013 : 02:04:26
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quote:
Originally posted by NancyB
quote:
But I think I already posted Martha's baptism in an earlier post.
Well, that is embarrassing! You are absolutely right, Jkmarler. And I even saved and printed that record when you posted it. But when I was putting together a quick pedigree chart, I overlooked that. On the plus side, it's good to know I can find something in the archives--even if I have trouble transcribing it.
On that particular record, I think I picked up her confirmation date (1 Oct 1871), but I'm at a loss for deciphering her mother's name. But, I may be getting too far off track anyway.
Don't beat yourself about it... Most folks who present queries here are afraid to even try reading the Norwegian records. They defeat themselves by not even beginning. But really that is the only way to learn. Study the whole page to get a feel for how the scribe is writing various letters and how words are abbreviated and capitalized. I used to trace words that I couldn't decipher, to become familiar with how the letters are formed. Eventually you'll have the epiphany you want.
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 25/10/2013 : 19:49:07
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Study the whole page to get a feel for how the scribe is writing various letters and how words are abbreviated and capitalized.
For this particular record #85, it appears to me that the scribe is not listing the mother's name, but instead is listing that she is Peter's daughter along with a farm name (based on the 'vald' ending I notice on several records). Does anyone else see it that way? I'm curious to know how I'm doing at interpreting the record.
Thanks! |
NancyB |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 26/10/2013 : 02:51:55
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If you are linking to the same image posted earlier, her mother's first name is included and yes she is listed as a Pedersd. The name might be unfamiliar to you, you could look at how its rendered in the 1865 census listing to try to figure out the handwriting.
As to the farm name you have identified one element in the name as "vald". I'd advise that you also think vold. You can do a farm name search in the 1865 census by clicking on the link provided to the 1865 census in Levanger and then clearing search result "to bort sok resultat" by clicking those words and and then you will get a clean search engine in which you could look for every farm containing (innheld) the letters vald or vold. Of course the problem is the target farm is in Verdal (Værdal) but this is just for practice. |
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 26/10/2013 : 05:22:52
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quote:
Originally posted by jkmarler
If you are linking to the same image posted earlier, her mother's first name is included and yes she is listed as a Pedersd. The name might be unfamiliar to you, you could look at how its rendered in the 1865 census listing to try to figure out the handwriting.
Yes, I was referring to the previous link. I thought I had the linking figured out, but see now that it didn't work. And, the mother's name has been hiding in plain site all along--including on the census record already provided. So now I know it is Guru (or some variation of).
I don't think I'm as close to finding Betsy as I thought I was a few days ago, but a lot of new information has been found this week. Thanks to all for your help. |
NancyB |
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 30/11/2013 : 04:27:12
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Finally, a new piece of information in the search for Betsy Johnson! I received in the mail today the death certificate of Oscar F. Anderson, son of Alex and Betsy Anderson. The certificate lists Oscar's father as "John Anderson" [should be Alex Anderson] and his mother as "Betsy Runyan." The informant was Oscar's daughter Myrtle who would not have known her grandfather (d. 1887 when Oscar was 5), but would have known her grandmother who lived with Oscar's family for a time while Myrtle was still home (1930 census; Myrtle age 20).
Some of you may recall that the transcription of Alex and Betsy's marriage record lists her as Betsy R. Johnson. That is the only place I've seen an R, but seeing her name listed as Runyan on the death certificate is very interesting.
I'm sorry, but I'm not finding a way to search in English for someone by name without guessing at a county and/or parish.
Quick refresher:
Betsy Ann Johnson / Betsy Ann Belle Johnson / Betsy R. Johnson
b. 28 Feb 1850 in Bergen (according to obituary and family stories)
Emigrated at age 18 (according to obituary)
d. 1934 in Iowa
Thank you for any help you can provide.
Nancy |
NancyB |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 30/11/2013 : 16:49:11
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Hey Nancy, thanks for this. So glad you hung in there to get this new clue.
I just quickly checked the farm search in the 1865 census but found none named Runyan, so this name may be an "Anglicization" of a Norwegian name either as it spells or sounds.
There are many farms which start as Run.., Rund... but it could also represent R*n... with *=any vowel including ø. Yan might be a representation of a common suffix in Norwegian like "øyen" / "øen" or the particular pronounciation of words like "Trondheim" or "Stenehjem" over here as "Trondjem" or "Stenejem" or the spelling of "ien" or "ion" over here. |
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NancyB
Medium member
USA
104 Posts |
Posted - 30/11/2013 : 20:48:49
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quote:
Originally posted by jkmarler
Hey Nancy, thanks for this. So glad you hung in there to get this new clue.
I just quickly checked the farm search in the 1865 census but found none named Runyan, so this name may be an "Anglicization" of a Norwegian name either as it spells or sounds.
There are many farms which start as Run.., Rund... but it could also represent R*n... with *=any vowel including ø. Yan might be a representation of a common suffix in Norwegian like "øyen" / "øen" or the particular pronounciation of words like "Trondheim" or "Stenehjem" over here as "Trondjem" or "Stenejem" or the spelling of "ien" or "ion" over here.
Thank you for doing this research! I will save this information, and perhaps it will mean something in the future. Meanwhile, I keep hoping something will turn up in the Boone County records.
Nancy |
NancyB |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2013 : 23:13:11
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Runyan, Runy-almost same pron. in Norwegian as Røni- ; Rønning-Rønningen?
A common farm name in Norway.
Kåre |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2013 : 23:38:36
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Most of the Norwegian born Runyan found in US records appear to have got that name by marriage to a Yankee with the name. There are a few instances of a name like Run (1870), Runien (1850 2 men in Delafield, Waukesha county, Wisconsin) , Rundunn (household headed by Ole J living in Minnehaha county [south] Dakota Territory) etc. But most of those are wobbly writing in the original. Did see one young man age 19 named Ole Run in 1870 Decorah, Winneshiek county, Iowa -- he worked in a store or a bank as a clerk. But couldn't find him in later records with any certainty.
It does seem clear that Betsy is not to be found as baptized in Bergen (search in the database at Digitalarkivet). Perhaps she was from the outlying parishes around Bergen in Hordaland. |
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Betsy Johnson of Bergen
