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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
 Posted - 11/02/2006 : 03:17:31
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| I am trying to locate ancestors from when they lived in Norway. I have a Christian Johnson b. Feb 1829 d. Apr 30, 1918 immigrated in 1867 from Norway resided in Marshall County Minnesota. First wife Eliza Johnson possibly a Erickson and had 6 children john, anna, erick, charley, sophia, paul all born betwenn 1855-1868. Christians second wife was Lena Torgerson or Torgersdatter Ronningen. Lena was born Oct 1855, d. Sep 24, 1935 they had 9 children. Olaf, Theodore, Charley, Helmer, Juluis, Edwin, Nora, Otto and Clara. Otto and Clara were twins and Clara is my great grandmother. Children were born between years 1877-1896. I'm am having trouble locating them before 1880 and am in need of guidance or direction on where to look for them next. Please email me at CSchreiner88@aol.com with any suggestions. |
Christie Faymonville |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 11:57:34
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Hi,
here is your family in Bennington, Mower County, Minnesota, in census-1880:
Christian Johnson (51)
Eliza Johnson (52)
John Johnson (25)
Anna Johnson (22)
Erick Johnson (19) born in Norway
Charley Johnson (16), born in Wisconsin
Sophia Johnson (14), born in Minnesota
Paul Johnson (12), born in Minnesota
This must be the christening records for their 3 oldest children:
Johan Christiansen
Birth: 08 JUL 1854 Skien, Telemark, Norway
Parents: Christian Johannesen & Elise Karine Eriksen link
Anne Pauline Christiansen
Birth: 02 OCT 1857 Skien, Telemark, Norway
Parents: Christian Johannesen & Elise Karine Eriksen link
Erik Christiansen
Birth: 30 NOV 1860 Skien, Telemark, Norway
Parents: Christian Johannssen & Elise Karine Eriksen link
Charley Johnson is 16 years old in census-1880, and is born in Wisconsin. He could be born in 1866 then, which indicates that the family emigrated before 1867.
I could not locate the family in census-1865 for Skien in Telemark county, Norway. The census was recorded January 1st, 1866.
Christian & Elise Karine married 17 APR 1854. link
Christian's father is Johannes Kittelsen.
Elise Karine's parents are Erik Paulsen & Anne Karine Jacobsen.
Here is a lot of family info about Eliza Johnson aka Elise Karine Eriksen
Jan Peter |
Edited by - jwiborg on 11/02/2006 12:17:47 |
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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 17:40:11
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Thank you for taking the time to investigate this. You gave me a wealth of information. I do have all the information from the American census from 1880 and Lena makes her first appearance with Christian in 1885. I found a township census for 1885 but it just listed Olaf, Theodore and Charley and Elmer which are Lena's children. Thank you for pointing out that they must have immigrated earlier because once I looked at it your right, so I could stop wasting my time looking for immigration papers from 1867, but I bet that might be the year he became a citizen. I'm writing for his naturalization papers but they take up to 6 months to process.
Where you able to find anything about Lena or a death year for Eliza. My grandmother was the one who believed Lena's maiden name to be Torgerson. I followed some messages on a roots web and they led to a Oline Torgersdatter Ronningen, but I could never find a Oline Torgersdatter Ronningen to see if her dates matched my Lena. Her name is listed differently everywhere Oline, Olina, Olena, Lena. On roots web I followed Nora Rust who was Lena and Christian's 7th daughter and that lead to the possible new name. It also mentioned a Hans Torgerson as her possible brother b. 23 Feb 1845 in Torpa, Nordre Land with four siblings in Hillsboro county ND. and a sister Olena (possibly Johnson).
Thank you so much I am so excited about all the new information you gave me dating back to about 1713.
Christie Faymonville
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Christie Faymonville |
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Jo Anne Sadler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
1100 Posts |
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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 21:13:42
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| Thank you Jo Anne I appreciate the help. |
Christie Faymonville |
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DALB
Medium member
USA
143 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 21:49:36
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This could be your Christian and Elise - no children are listed - this is very likely from when they signed out of the parish in 1862 - they just may not have listed the children. The first Erik died the same month he was born, per one of the records on IGI.
Telemark Exit Fiche - 002 - 000323 Skien (Te) 1862
Christian Johannesen 32
Elise Karine Eriksd 34
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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
Posted - 11/02/2006 : 22:00:17
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Thank you Dalb
How did you go about finding them in a parish. I think they were Lutheran's but I wouldn't even know where to start looking. I am so new at this and would love to see the link to see how you found them and see the records if possible. At least I know they were in Norway in 1862 and Wisconsin in 1864.
p.s. (what does IGI stand for)? |
Christie Faymonville |
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DALB
Medium member
USA
143 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 00:38:12
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There are several selections for elise karine eriksen, born 22 Sept 1827, in the IGI.
LDS (Mormon's) website - www.familysearch.org - Search tab -
IGI (international genealogical index)
enter in appropriate spaces - elise karine - eriksen - Norway - Telemark
click on # 12 - under spouse, click on - Family - this brings up 4 children -
# 3 - brings up the Erik who died soon after birth. |
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Jean Marthaler
Junior member
USA
56 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 01:53:19
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Earlier today I received an e-mail from Christie and I played with the records. According to the 1900 census for Marshall County, Minnesota, Christian and Oline were married for 22 years which would put them married in the 1877-1878 time period. I find this family who I would believe is them in the 1880 census living in Polk County, Minnesota. My question is how did the family have Olaf, age 3 and Theodore, age 1 in the 1880 census and still have Christian living in Mower County with his first wife and children and be listed as married 22 years in the 1900 census for Marshall County. Did he lead a double life with his wife being sickly perhaps and did the family move to Marshall County after his wife may have died after the 1880 census in Mower County. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Does Christie know for a fact that the family in the Mower County census are her Christian with his first wife. I am putting this Polk County 1880 census info on the forum here to get any new thoughts from others. JEAN
Nordmenn i Minnesota i 1880-teljinga - Digitalarkivet
Given name Last name Sex Age Occupation Birth place Father birth place Mother birth place Page Circuit County State
80160 Chr Johnson m 51 f N N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
80161 Oline J Johnson f 25 wife N N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
80162 Mathias Johnson m 23 N N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
80163 Baerent Johnson m 20 N N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
80164 Olaf O Johnson m 3 Ia N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
80165 Theodore Johnson m 1 Mn N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
80166 Ludvig Johnson m 14 N N N 303 Halstead Polk Minnesota
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Jean Marthaler
Junior member
USA
56 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 01:57:40
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Below is what I found on the possible immigration of the Oline (Lena) that Christie is looking for and below that entry is who I believe to be Oline and family in the 1865 census. JEAN
Emigranter fra Oslo 1867-1930
Harbour No. Year Month Day Given name Last name Sex Position Occupation Age Residence Destination Remarks Foreigner Freight Line
35425 Oslo 0471A 1875 Mai 28 Johannes Hansen m u Arbm. 20 Nordre Lands P. Lansing Iowa 4112 Norge Betalt Hero
35426 Oslo 0471B 1875 Mai 28 Oline Torgersdatter f u Tjenestepige 20 Nordre Lands P. Lansing Iowa 4113 Norge Betalt Hero
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Census year: 1865
Municipality: Søndre Land
Municipality number: 0536
Name of domicile: Rødningen
Number of persons in this domicile: 5
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Name Family status Marital status Occupation Birth year Place of birth Ethnicity
Torgeir Torgeirsen Husfader e Husmand med Jord 1806 Lands Prgj.
Ingeborg Torgeirsdatter hans Datter ug bestyrer hans Husholdning 1848 Lands Prgj.
Syver Torgeirsen hans Søn ug 1851 Lands Prgj.
Oline Torgeirsdatter hans Datter ug 1854 Lands Prgj.
Niels Torgeirsen hans Søn ug 1857 Lands Prgj.
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Norwegian Historical Data Centre (NHDC)
The Faculty of Social Sciences, University of Tromsø N-9037 Tromsø, NORWAY
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Jean Marthaler
Junior member
USA
56 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 05:25:21
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Christie, I am wondering if you know for a fact that the family you have listed in your start of this search was indeed the family of Christian Johnson. I am not asking this to doubt you but I just wanted to be sure we are working with the correct information.
Just in case the info isn't correct I did come up with the following info that would somewhat go along with the 1880 census records showing 13 year old Ludvig and 20 year old Baernt Johnson. I am putting this on the Forum just in case any new clues come up etc. JEAN
According to the 1900 Marshall County, Township # 158 census records, Christian Johnson was born in February, 1829 and immigrated in 1867.
In the 1870 census for Center Township, Allamakee County Iowa, I find a 41 year old Christian Johnson living with 14 year old John and 4 year old Ludwig with all of them born in Norway.
One of the reasons I checked out Iowa is that in the 1880 census the 3 year old son, Olaf was born in Iowa.
Also in Makee Twp., Allamakee County, Iowa I find a 10 year old Bernt Christenson living with an Ole Johnson, age 29 and his wife, Isabella, age 29. They are all born in Norway. They have a 2 year old son, John born in Norway and a 6 month old daughter named Mary who was born in Iowa.
Could this be Christie’s Christian Johnson with 2 of his children living with him and his son, Bernt living with perhaps a relative?
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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 07:23:31
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In the 1880 census Christian is listed with an Elise Johnson who was his first wife. She must have passed somewhere between 1868 and 1877 because in the 1885 census Christain is with Olena in Halstead county MN with 4 of her boys. I always thought it was weird that Christain is never listed with any of his 1st marriage kids but in 1885 Paul the youngest was 17 so he might of already been off on his own. Plus my Olena was 22 yrs younger than Christain so he was probably looking for more farm laborers and she gave him 7 more boys and 2 girls. I was thinking maybe he went back to Norway to pick another bride persay but I'm sure I'm not going to prove that one.
I do know about the Allmakee Iowa census and I'm not sure if there's a connection. I found Christain in a 1860 census at age 32 which would be right on, and he was living with a Magnus Johnson so maybe he came first and than his wife and kids came? His son Charley was the first to be born in US in 1964. I'm going to list all the kids I have so we can compare ages I'll start a new message. |
Christie Faymonville |
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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 07:53:43
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Christian Johannesen b. 27 Feb 1829 Skien, Telemark, Norway
married Elise Karine Eriksen 17 Apr 1854 Skien she was born 22 Sep 1827
Children
Johan Christiansen b. 8 Jul 1854 Skien
Anna Pauline Christiansen 2 Oct 1857 Skien
Erik Christiansen 30 Nov 1860 Skien
Charley Christiansen 1864 Wisconsin
Sophia Christansen 1866 Wisconsin
Paul 1868 Minnesota
Mary Erickson b. 1817 Norway sister-in-law of Elise
I learned the top 3 kids full names and birthdays today, but all are located on a 1880 census from Bennington Mower, MN
Than in the 1900 census he's with Lena who was born Oct 1855 and d. 24 Sep 1935
Olaf C b. Iowa Feb 1877
Theodore C Oct 1878 MN
Charley O.C. Dec 1880 MN
Helmer E.C. May 1883 MN
Juluis C. Oct 1885 MN
Edwin B.C. March 1888 MN
Nora M.C. June 1889 MN
Otto B.C. March 9 1896
Clara N.C. March 9 1896
Here's what I know about the family through family. Clara is my great great grandmother. My grandma is still alive and remembered her aunt Nora marrying a Rust so I googled the name and started at Rootsweb which lead me to ancestry.com. Now my grandmothers mom's maiden was Johnson and her dad was Jornlin. 3 kids from the Johnson family married 3 kids from the Jornlin family not incest thank heavens so I can track those 3 families Helmer, Otto and Clara through a Jornlin family tree book that they had published in 1972. Now interesting fact is that Clara passed when my gram was 18 months from typhoid so Clara's husband was so upset I guess he never really talked about family again. Not sure how when when the families are so intertwined but thats history. Now my Gram had an aunt who told her for sure that Grandpa Christain was married twice and had about 14 kids. My gram told me that last month and here I am finding 15 kids. Am I positive about my findings on the first marriage? The ages all add up and it does list 15 kids starting in Norway in 1855 and ending in MN in1896 . Only births that overlap are the twins and one of them being my g.g. gram I know that ones right so I think this is one big family. Does anyone have any ideas on how to know for sure if I'm right?
I have to say coming to this website has by far been my best move. Your all so wonderful for helping me with my family.
Thank you
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Christie Faymonville |
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DALB
Medium member
USA
143 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 19:26:26
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I believe you have the correct family for Christian Johnson and his second wife, in the 1900 census. And you have links to prove it.
But, I think you need to rethink the family you have listed as yours for the 1880 census.
On the 1900 census, your Olaf was born in 1877 in Iowa, and Theadore was born 1878 in MN. They both should be listed with their father on the 1880 census. Your Olaf and Theadore, who were born before 1880, are not llsted with the family you believe is yours in 1880, in Mower Co MN.
Recheck the family so noted in an earlier posting, who lived at Halstead, Polk, MN in 1880. I do believe this is more likely to be the family you should be reseaching.
Chr. Johnson 51, Oline T Johnson 25, Mathias 23 born Norw., Borent 20 born Norw, Olaf O 3 born Iowa, Theadore 1, born MN, Ludwig 14 b Norw.
Very likely, Christians first wife died in Iowa and that could be where he remarried to Oline.
It is not unusual to find that you have traced the wrong family. Sometimes you need to research a family just to prove they do not belong to you. |
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cfaymonville88
Starting member
Norway
8 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 22:55:42
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Thank you
That makes so much sense. I never even thought of the 1880 census and how Olaf and Theo should be there. Halstead Polk is where I first found Lena and Christian and it would make more sense that Christian lived there with his first family and moved to Minnesota with Lena rather with first family than going back to Iowa and than going to MN again.
Thank you everyone, I have plenty of work to keep me busy now.
Christie |
Christie Faymonville |
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Jean Marthaler
Junior member
USA
56 Posts |
Posted - 12/02/2006 : 23:46:37
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Hi, I decided I needed to try and find the family of Christian Johnson in Norway since the children John, Bernt and Ludvig in the family in 1870 in Allamakee, Iowa were born in Norway and the sons, Mathias and Baernt in the 1880 census in Halstead, Polk County, Minnesota were born in Norway. Below is a family who matches them perfectly. I do believe this is them and the family in Mower County is a totally different family. JEAN
Census year: 1865
Municipality: Ringsaker
Municipality number: 0412
Name of domicile: Halli
Number of persons in this domicile: 7
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Name Family status Marital status Occupation Birth year Place of birth Ethnicity
Christian Johansen Huusfader g Husmand med Jord 1829 Ringsager
Berte Gulliksdatter hans Kone g 1829 Ringsager
Johannes Christiansen deres Søn ug 1855 Ringsager
Mattias Christiansen deres Søn ug 1856 Ringsager
Bernt Christiansen deres Søn ug 1860 Ringsager
Agnet Christiansdatter deres Datter ug 1863 Ringsager
Ingeborg Johannesdatter ug Sypige 1839 Ringsager
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Christian Johnson Lena Torgerson or Torgersdatter
