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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
 Posted - 06/04/2008 : 05:16:07
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married Ragnele Johansdatter of Hundere Sogn og Fjordane on 15 Mar 1808.
Linky
There seems to be some kind of marriage banns posted for them or some kind of agreement about the marriage between Tosten & Ragnele's father before the marriage, but I'm only guessing that is what the parish record is about. Help! What's it say?
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 06:14:06
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Only the three first lines concerns the wedding -
Ko****ret 1. Pin.
Torsten Andersen Alme, Ungk. (bachelor) og Ragnilde Johan-
nesdatter Hundere, Pige (Maiden)
Then a baptismal record follows. |
Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 06/04/2008 06:14:58 |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 06:19:48
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A baptism? They were both baptised years earler, him in Hafslo & her in Sogndahl.
Thank you. Now, if the server over there would stop acting up so I can take anther look!!! |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 08:17:32
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| The baptisme thatfollow is for Johannes, the son of Ole Johanesen, Qvale and Anne Pedersdatter! |
Einar |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 08:34:03
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| That's for the marriage record on the 15th of March. I'm talking about the info at the second link, on Feb 13th. |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 10:51:36
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Well, this was a tough one - here it is
Da jeg underskrevne Unge-Karl og Soldat Torsten Andersen agter at indgaae udi Egteskab med Pigen Ragnilde Johannes Dr. Hundere; saa er hermed wor Begiæring til Sognepresten Hr Kamstrup at der af Predikestolen maae skee den anbefalede Tillysning – thi er det til desswidermere bekreftelse; at Løytenanden selv; saawelsom Læste Pigens Fader herved sit navn underskriver
Torsten Andersen Alme - Johanes Johanesen Hundere
(med holdt pen)
Since I the undersigned bachelor and soldier Torsten Andersen intend to enter into matrimony with the girl Ragnilde Johannesdatter, Hundere it is hereby our petition to the Parish mr Kamstrup that it from the pulpit must be given the recommended announcement – and this is furthermore confirmed by the lieutenant himself as well as the named girls father who hereby gives their signature.
Torsten Andersen Alme - Johanes Johanesen Hundere
(with held pen) |
Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 06/04/2008 18:59:32 |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 17:01:19
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Thank you! Do you think that would be an "absolvement" rather than marriage banns & it was written by Tosten, rather than the pastor? She would have to have been pregnant before March, as their first daughter (Kiestine) was baptised on 4 Sep 1808 (stories of premature birth aside).
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2008 : 19:53:36
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I don't think this is an absolvement - it was quite common that a girl was pregnant before they married, many married close up to the birth and som gave birth to a child without being married - a socalled "uægte" child - it was unlawful and formal absolvement was given in church.
This info in the parish record is the first time I have seen, but announcement about an intended marriage should be given in the church three times, some parish records give the dates for these announcements in a separate column intended for this. |
Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 06/04/2008 19:59:09 |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 07/04/2008 : 22:19:04
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The parish book that record came from has more of those same kind of announcements, so it must have been a quirk of mr Kamstrup.
I know the medieval Catholic Church held engagements to be as binding as marriages, but didn't know that standard was kept by any of the Protestant churches & into the 19th century.
Early American colonial court records list floggings & fines charged to parents of children born out of wedlock (or more than 7 months "premature"), but I'm not sure that practice lasted later than the 17th century. It's possible, but there hasn't been any interest in transcribing beyond the 17th century, so I don't know. |
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Mariann Alme Samuelsen
New on board
Norway
4 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 01:51:17
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I am wondering if you have more information on Torsten Andersen Alme.
My great grandfather came from Hafslo or Alme.
Names are Elling Olsen Alme and son Erik Elingsen Alme born 1850
Thank you very much,
from Mariann Alme Samuelsen |
Mariann |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 02:30:34
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I have quite a bit on Tosten's line, but don't know if or how it connects with your family. Tosten's wife Ragnhild (born circa 1785 died 6 Sep 1812) Her death record & the baptismal record of their daughter were within days of each other. He remarried (Ingeri Erichsdatter from Tørvi) & went on to have 8 more children Anders, Erich, Anne, Hermund, another Anne, Tosten, Einer & Niels. I haven't had a chance to search for their children yet, but I have names on the spouses of his daughters.
Anne bap 21 Aug 1822 married Hermund Andersen of Alme 16 Apr 1844
Christine bap 4 Sep 1808 married Christoffer Thomasen of Alme 24 Jun 1834. All 4 of the childrenthat I have for them were born between 1835 & 1843.
Giertrude bap 4 Nov 1810 married Siur Trondsen from Hollekve & all of their children were born at Hollekve.
Going back a generation from Tosten looks more promising. Tosten's father died pretty young & his wife (Kirsti Ørbech Adamsdatter-Reitz) remarried Hermund Ellendsen (I see Elling commonly switched to Ellend & visa versa in records) from Hunderie. They had three children together & were at Alme for the 1801 census together, so I assume the children were born there.
Sønneve (name is also spelled Synneve in some records where the girl has that name) Hermundsdatter was born about 1800
Anders Hermundsen was baptised Apr 1797 in Hafslo
they also had a daughter Anne Magrethe Hermundsdatter born about 1802, but I have no additional info for her.
Do you know how to use the data bases at digital inn at the national archives? The ones for the whole fylke are hit or miss, mostly miss for Hafslo parish, but the three for Hafslo parish have been most helpful.
His son Erich was baptised 14 Apr 1816, so he may be another good candidate for you. |
Edited by - Holly on 08/04/2008 02:33:13 |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 07:28:30
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How sure are you on Hafslo Parish? I searched the data bases that I know about for Hafslo parish (birth, marriage & death, plus I looked at a couple of different census' for the farm) & found I nothing in them that would help you in your quest.
There are two more farms in the same fylke named Alme (one in Lyster & the other in Gloppen), plus there are a couple of Almens. |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 07:57:12
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Your Sønneved Hermundsdatter was baptized Oct 24 1799, see top and midle of right hand page here
Hermund and Kirstina were at Alme.
You have probably also seen the engagement between Hermund and Kirstina April 14 1796, it is on the left hand page here
I see that Hermund was a teacher.
Their second daughter Anna Margreta was baptized Febr 21 1802, see bottom of right column on left hand page here
Their first child Anders was baptized April 30 1797, see at the bottom of left column right hand page here
All three are born at Alme. |
Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 08/04/2008 08:46:55 |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 08:41:29
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I haven't wandered into the column where that engagement was much yet. I'm mostly happy to discover that I haven't plugged in any burial notices as birth records.... least I don't think I have.
A teacher? I know the word for teacher is the same in Norwegian as it is in German, but spelled differently, something like lehrer (4 years of German & about the only German that I can remember is a "dialog" that I learned the first year, that happens to include the word lehrer) & there's nothing in that record that I could say would be that word. |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 08:55:13
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It says "Unge Karl og Skoleholder Hermund Ellendsen Hundere - -" Skoleholder (skole = school - holde = keep) is the word for teacher at that time, the teacher moved around between the farms - there was no schoolbuilding as such.
Anders was burried Jan 22 1800. |
Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 08/04/2008 09:04:25 |
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Holly
Medium member
USA
95 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 09:20:25
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| I thought that there was something that I read for my Aust Agder families that said the students went to the teacher's house for instruction, but I coudn't begin to tell you which century. |
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Tosten / Torsten Anders of Alme
