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davidcarlsen
Senior member
USA
398 Posts |
 Posted - 04/04/2011 : 09:08:29
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Here is a marriage record for Jan Jonsen/Stine Andersd - marriage - engagement is Oct 251793 marriage is Jan 25 1794 same page.
Here is a burial record for a stillborn boy - Jan Warme/StineAndersd - death record - bottom right
Here is a death record for a Jan Warme no age given.
May 11 on the left side
Here is 1801 census referring to Jan Warme.
1801
Are Jan Jonsen and Jan Warme the same person? In other words did Jan Jonsen begin calling himself Jan Warme or being referred to as Jan Warme for some reason.
Or are they 2 husbands for Stine?
One more bit of info - birthchristening of son Ole to Jan Jonsen/Stine in 1802 - so Jan is now Jonsen again - Ole
another child - in 1806 Marthe June 14 right side |
Edited by - davidcarlsen on 12/09/2021 23:02:17 |
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janrm
Medium member
Norway
80 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2011 : 11:01:40
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Quite hard books you are working on! I am impressed by your finds!
I think we are talking about two Jan Warme, the one buried May 11, 1765 could be related to your Jan Warme, aged 31 and "blacksmith" at Eidsfos Iron Works in 1801. (Perhaps grandad/grandson, just a speculation...)
Those days confusing variations in names&ages were quite common, unfortunately. Remember that these people most likely could not read or write, spelling was then depending upon which minister who wrote the books!
"Jan Jonsen" and "Jan Warme" could hence pretty much be the same person, bur it would have to be verified....
..same with funerals, if noone could tell exact age they made assumptions...
Jan, Norway. |
Jan, (Mr.) Norway |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2011 : 11:41:40
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It would be easier to follow your questions if you did not change topic so often, ref. this topic and other topics.
I am quite convinced that Jan Jonsen and Jan Warme is one and the same person. The children he had with Stine Andersdatter was
Andreas, baptized Febr 23 1794,
Berthe, baptized Dec 26 1796,
Jon (or Jan), Nov 2 1799,
Ole, baptized Nov 20 1802,
Marthe, baptized June 14 1806,
Stillborn boy March 1811.
No time for death and remarriage here.
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Einar |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2011 : 11:58:01
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Put those things in date order -
11 May 1765 death record in Hof, Vestfold - obviously NOT the same Jan Warme since dies 29 years before the 1794 marriage.
Oct 1793 engagement in Hof, Vestfold - Jan Jonsen & Stine Andersdtr
25 Feb 1794 marriage in Hof, Vestfold -Jan Jonsen & Stine Andersdtr of Eidsfoss
Feb 1801 census - Jan Warme & Stine Andersdtr in Hof, Vestfold with three young children - Ironworker? at "Eidsfos Jernværk" (The 1801 census for Hof/Hoff indicates only ONE Stine Andersdtr in that area at the time, two persons listed with Warme as last name, no other Jan/Jon Jonsen (or other spelling variations possible) in the area at that time. Birthplaces not given in 1801 census.)
20 Nov 1802 baptism of Ole - parents Jan Jonsen Eidsfoss & Stine Andersdtr
14 June 1806 baptism of Marthe - parents John Jonsen & Stine Andersdtr Eidsfoss
March 1811 burial of infant child of Jan Warme &Stine Andersdtr from Eidsfoss
There would be no reason a "Jan Jonsen" couldn't be called Jon Warme at some times IF he had some family tie to that non-patronymic name - perhaps a family name much used by earlier generation(s) or perhaps a family link to a location of the name Warme or similar.
It is a perfectly acceptable alternative identification in that case. LDS library catalog shows earlier research has been written about a Swedish line of Warme named ironworker(s).
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2011 : 16:21:38
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I believe Jan (Jon) Jonsen (Warme in 1801) was baptized Dec 26 1770, see last baptismal record in 1770.
His parents were Jon Olsen and Maria Jansdatter from Eidsfos.
One of the witneses was Jan Varme, most likely the grandfather = mothers father and the Jan Warme, Eidsberg burried in 1811.
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Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 04/04/2011 18:02:28 |
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davidcarlsen
Senior member
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 04/04/2011 : 17:59:41
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| Thanks all for your help and insight. I apologize for the additional topic. I wanted to consolidate what I had learned to date and get a fresh look at the combined information. It has been productive and I thank you all again. janrm - when you speak of verifying the connection, what resources could available as the DA would not seem to be a definitive source for that as there would not be two birth records for instance? |
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JamesKennedy
New on board
USA
4 Posts |
Posted - 13/07/2012 : 21:09:49
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This is something that my Dad tried to translate which may be of interest. It is from an original source which I could provide although I suspect some have it.
The translation has some clear issues but it does have some interesting information about this family
===
According to family tradition, two brothers immigrated from Vermaland Warme. I have
collected some biographical data and hope that others possibly can supplement these. You
can reach when it comes to the first paragraph in an environment of ironworks people who
get one to hope that a cultural historian would take up the work of the old hammer smiths
and masovnmestre. Also worse does not verify my research tradition, as I have only found a
<stern "father of Warme-ne.
At the Hof Church was 11 / 5 1765 buried Jan. Warme from Eidsfos. The shift after the deceased
blacksmith hammer Jahn Jahnsen Warme 19 sept. 1765 is the widow Berta Olsdtr. and children:
1) Ole Jansen, 25, 2) Jahn Jansen 21, 3) Marie Jahnsdtr. Joen Olsen married and lives in West
Falls, 4) Martin Jaensdtr. married Anders Dahl at Hougsund of Eger.! 5) Anne Lisbeth Jansdtr.
18. For bankruptcy court met Ole Jansen maternal and sibling's behalf.
The shift referred to a sentence of 12 / 4 p. å things in the book where nice that Jan Warme was
fined in a gossip story.
3 / 3 1793 was buried Berte Olsdtr. Warme from exhibitions describe 84 years.
1.
Ole Jansen Warme is opført in skattemandtallet for 1766.
This is bl. a. during July: Ole Warme fløtted.
In the County of Larvik archive it says in a letter from over ¬ Fabricius inspector to inspector in
1770 was 10.31 Hebor Ole Jansen Warme transferred from plants to Naess Moholt as champion.
He later came Hans Pedersen. Ole Warme was almost adjunge ¬ year old champion Jones by
Hans Næss hammer.
Ole Jansen Warme died 3 / 6 1821, 80 years old. He stayed with his son masovnmester January
Warme at Fossum Works. Ole Warme was first married to Aasta Pedersdtr. died 23/10 1789, 43
years old. Their wedding day''not known. She was possibly of the genus Friis, since several of
these names were buddies going for Dec. children, and her last child was baptized Nils Friis.
Their children were: a) Jan, dpt. in Siljan church} 13 October 1771, d. 26/472. b) Agata, dpt.
31} 1 1773, d. 27 / 6 p. å c) Agate, dpt. 10} July 1774, d. 28/12 1783. d) Birthe Maria, dpt. 28
/ 8 1777, goblets. 30 March 1816}. See further below. e) Jan, dpt. 7 / 111779, d. 28/10 1868.
See further below. f) Mary Elizabeth, dpt. 11 / 8 1782, d. 18 / 2 1812. g) Peder, dpt. 24/10 1784,
conference 1801, death is not known. h) Pernille; b. 6 / 8 1786, d. 26 / 3 1872. See further below.
i) Nils Friis, b. 23/10 1783, d. s. å
Among the sponsors of the children exists a number of Larvik People: Peder Pergaard, Hans
Jansen Horn, masovnmester Nils Friis Pedersen, Søren Blom, Margrete Holst, Agathe Jansdtr.
Horn, Simon Borse, Peder Jacobsen Berhug, Just Jansen Horn, Inger Horn, master mason Knud
Bierkholm, Jacob Winter, Christian Tyrholm, Peder Nilsen Friis, Hans Friis, Ole Larsen Dyring,
Ole Warme married the second time in X church with the Virgin Mary Else Wright, daughter
of Andreas Christian W. and John Peder ¬ DTR. Lindseth. It was 9 / 11 1791 and was best man
Capitain Hede ¬ march and Sr. Peter Wright.
City Doctor Olaf Willoch, Larvik, formulas his rip-rip-great-grandfather's signet ring.
1. d) Birthe Marie Warme was 10 / 5 1805 married the Danish work printer, I heard the Ulefoss,
Ole Christian Knutzen. Their son was the Knud knew skolemand Olaus Knutzen.
1. e) Jan Warme was first married 21 / 2 1803 with Anne Elisa beth ¬ Svendsen, b. 27/12
1785, d. 20/10 1803, daughter of masovnmes ¬ ter Poul Peter Svendsen from Holden. They
had a daughter Olava Svend John Sine, b. 14/10 1803, goblets. 5 / 8 1804. January Warme
married the second time with Anne Catherine Rosenberg, dpt. 29 / 4 1772, daughter of Sheriff
Paul Rosenberg. They had children Poul Martin Rosenberg, b. 23 / 7 1810, d. before 1815 and
Olava Pauline, b. 3 / 12 1815, married 26 / 9 1844 to tanner champion Ole Peter Holm, Skien.
In "Fossum works through 400 years" it says: Among the many workers and officials with a long
service life of the plant should be mentioned masovnmesteren January Warme, who went by the
end of the 1840s after 54 years working at Fossum.
1. h) Pernille Olsdtr. Warme married 13 / 2 1811 with plant-fuldmektig Moholt works by Peder
Schøyen Nerdrum, later kjøbmand in Kongsberg, Norway, where he later went bankrupt and
died in 1821 at 515 Rud in Sandsvær. Pernille died with his son medical Peter Martin Nerdrum,
Inderøen. As a student in 1838 was Nerdrum sponsor for a son of Knud Olaus Knutzen together
with his friend Henrik Wergeland.
2.
January Warme Jansen who was buried 24 / 6 1802 in Forests, 58 years old, married 2 / 1 1777
with Berthe Kistine Erichsdtr. Red. He had Støen place in Hof and ran as a shoemaker, had in
1801 lease on the space below Kyterud Holmen Forests. Replacing after him took place 14/12
1803. Children:
a) Jahn Jahnsen, age 15, in the mother. See further below. b) Bertha, married m. Gullich Olsen
Fierdingen. c) Johanna Maria, married w. Anders Gartholt Court in the parish. d) Catherine Elen,
21 gm Ole Olssøn the Knife parish. e) Elisabeth, 121 / 2 years.
. Birthe Kirstine was the daughter of ladders Erich Thoresen.
2. a) Jahn Jahnsen Warme was christened 4 / 3 1786, goblets. 26 / 2 1817, death of vådeskud. He
married 18/12 1809 with Eli Torchildsdtr. Westbye, dpt, 2 / October 1774, d. 1855.
In the Forests The book says that he at dawn one morning in an oat cakes were shot by neighbor
lying there, waiting for a bear, but accidentally shot his neighbor. He lived as an invalid after
a while and the man who inadvertently had loosened the shot to be a noble way have sought to
make his family harmless.
Jahn and Eli had children Torkel, b. 27 / 4 1810, d. 11/12, 1888, and Jahn, dpt, 25 / June 1813, d.
18 / 5 1818.
Torkel Jahnsen Westby took the name after his mother, whose family sat on Vestby from 1690-
1817. He married 22 / 4 1837 with Maren Kristine Jacobsdtr. Borge and has a large family after
the
Westbye name. .
In 1873 was sold to Eidsfos Works JJSchwartz, Gabriel Bay Cappelen, Anders L. Olsen, a
farmer in Forests Torehild Westby. He was an employ of drammenske and lumber dealers used
the very man he was later released. He helped his son J Ohana Westbye and his svigersøn John
Rief to start a brewery in Horten.
3.
Marie Jansdtr. Warme, limit. 26 / 8 1809, married 22 / 8 1761 m. John Smith who died 18 / 5 1807. Jon
was a shoemaker. A couple of their children must be addressed when they took his mother's name, the
rest of The Man did. In a list of officers and workers at Eidsfos Jernværk 11/11 1783's opført Malm Fills
Jon Warme with his wife and three children, and his wife's mother. Their children were a) Bertha Mary,
b. 10 / 2 1765, b) Gunnild, dpt. 13 / 9 1767 and c) Jan, b. 13 / 9 1770.
3. a) It is probably the Berthe Marie Jonsdtr. as it was changing after 11/12 1822, married m. Erich
Hansen Nystrom, Eidsfos. 3. b) Gunild [onsdtr. had a son Jens Ejlertsen, born 1793, died 19/10 1859 as
marsovnmester.
3. c) Jan Jones was 29 / 1 1794 married m. Stiine Andersdtr. the works were. They had children Andrew,
dpt. 29 / 2 1794, Berthe Marie, dpt, 26/12 1796, Jon, dpt. 2 / 11 1799, Ole, b. 20/11 1802, Marthe, dpt. 14
/ 6 1806.
The census is opført January 1801 \ heat, 31 years, him-mersmed. In Hof parish 20 / 1 1850 is incorrect
opført buried January lance Warme, 89 years, it must be January Jones Warme, 79 years.
Son Jon is seen not to have used the name Warme. He was 8 / 4 vs. 1822 m. Marthe Knudsdtr. Hafsrød, b.
1797. They had children Jahn, b. 12 / 5 1830, Jorgen, b. 23/11 1832, Andreas, b. 18 / 9 1841 and Andrine
Marie, b. 11 / 9 1822.
In Drammen and District Tourist Association Yearbook 1947, devoted Eidsfos Works, quoted an old
Eidsfosmand Jens Berg, b. 1836, who had told about the Midsummer celebrations. He said that when the
dance were opened it was not until the mill owner, as Trustee and as tredjemand old JanWarme.
His son Ole Jahnsen Warme is what has descendants who today use the name. According to church
records for Sande given 15/10 1832 ungkarl Ole Jahnsen Warme from Eidsfoss, 30 years, the girl Birthe
Olsdtr. Hvardal, 30. Forl. Anders Nilsson, the Beach, Anders Jørgensen ibid.
During 1818, we find confirmed Birthe Olsdtr., Dpt. 29 / 8 1802, parents, Ole Olsen, Ingeborg Johnsdtr.
Weberg ..
Ole and Birthe had children:
a) Projections Olsdtr. Warme, 20 / 7 1831-24/2 1902, vs. 26/12 1861 m. Edward Simon Jacobsen Eder,
sailmaker.
b) Andrine Mathilde Warme, 4 / 9 1935 to 1905, vs. 4 / 6 1871 m. Carl Heffermehl, pakhusbetjent.
c) Johanne Marie Warme, b. 22 / 5 ~ 833, vs. 5 / 11 1865 m. Lars Ulsteen, sailmaker.
d) Maren Ole a Warme, b. 9 / 3 1839 gm Olaves Johansen, j esteem skipper,
e) Stine Gorina Warme, b. 8 / 8 1842. She had two sons Oluf Bernhard Sigvartsen Warme, b. 19 / 4 1869
Charles Albert b. 1877.
Inger Olsdtr. Warmer daughter-daughter Mrs. Aslaug Ellefsen, Drammen, has a dark sortlakert table. J. J.
W. 1771, presumably after January Jones Warme.
5.
Anne Elisabeth J ansdtr, Warme 1767 was 23.11 gm March ovnmester Niels Leuorsen, Eidsfoss,
she was 20 years and he is 48 years. They had 11 children. |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 13/07/2012 : 23:11:12
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Yoy are right about the two Warme brothers who came from Vermeland in Sweden.
Here is another Warme topic.
You also mention Nerdrum as sponsor together with Henrik Wergeland
Kåre |
Edited by - Kåarto on 13/07/2012 23:14:17 |
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JamesKennedy
New on board
USA
4 Posts |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 03:42:09
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That is interesting to me - to see and learn about Henrik Wergeland. I had no idea who he was, despite apparently being a friend to my great-great-grandfather, Knut Olaus Knutzen.
I had visited the Warme link that you provided but for some reason much of the content is striked and it seems there is no clear understanding of the Warme lineage.
You said that I was right about the siblings - are there other sources for the information?
Thanks |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 09:36:32
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I found a Swedish topic last year where the two Warme brothers who settled down in Norway were discussed.
Unfortunately I did not save the page.
Kåre |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 09:56:54
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Erling Willoch and Reidar Warme published 1964 4 pages (page 280-284) in NST Volume 19 reg. "Slekten Warme" The Warme family in Norway.
Publishing company: Norsk Slekthistorisk Forening. Link
Kåre |
Edited by - Kåarto on 18/07/2012 10:03:49 |
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JamesKennedy
New on board
USA
4 Posts |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 14:49:35
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Thank you, Kåarto. I think my biggest issue is that I have been unable to 100% understand/translate what was included in Skelton Warme, although I do have a pdf copy of it (and appreciate the link, too). I had previously been unable to locate it online.
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 18/07/2012 : 21:02:44
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Hi.
Have you tried this translater ?
As from above some word might be translated wrong:
- Anders Dahl at Hougsund, Hokksund of Eger (Eiker, Øvre Eiker)
- Ola Jansen Warme er oppført i skattemandtallet (is listed in the tax payer register) for 1766
- Ole Warme fløtted (moved out or in)
- Masovnmester - Blast furnace master
- Knud skolemand (Schoolman- Teacher)
- ...was buried 24/6 1802 in Forest, pobably in Skoger.
Skog or Skoger means forest.
- J Ohana Westby and his svigersøn (his son in law)
- The census is opført (listed) January 1801
- has a dark sortlakert (black lacquered) table
Kåre
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davidcarlsen
Senior member
USA
398 Posts |
Posted - 12/09/2021 : 23:01:21
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| This is just a very belated thank you for all the incredible work done and information supplied in the several posts to this topic made after my last post. There was an obvious pause in my availability to work on my genealogy. I have improved somewhat in my organization and therefore also wanted to edit the topic subject to inform as I refer to the topics that have been utilized in my searches about whom they were instead of a vague statement like the one used to post this one. Again, thank you so much for the effort expended and information supplied. |
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trying to resolve confusing situation - Jan Jonsen
