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SLGous
Starting member
South Africa
8 Posts |
 Posted - 12/01/2017 : 07:06:02
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Good day,
I please need help tracing my Norwegian ancestry:
Charles John PETERSEN (as on his Death Notice) but could be Carl/Karl John/Johan PEDERSEN
Born: 3 August 1868, Norway
Died: 29 August 1951, South Africa
Charles married Margarita/Margaret Marie/Maria JANSEN VAN RENSBURG
On his Death Notice his dad is Paulus Arthur PETERSEN from Oslo, Norway and mother Isabel from Oslo Norway.
Not 100% sure about the mom even if its on the Death Notices as Margarita's (his wife) mom was Isabel. Family member has the name Pegiota as the name for Charles mom. He also has it that they are from Bragenes, Norway.
He had two siblings that we know of, Peter Emil and Matilda.
I also don't have any information of when Charles left for South Africa or on what ship.
He married his wife, Margarita in 1902, Paul Pietersburg, Durban and had his first son in 1903 also in Durban.
Thank you so much |
Edited by - SLGous on 12/01/2017 14:41:31 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
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SLGous
Starting member
South Africa
8 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 14:43:21
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Thanks for the information.
I added something on my original post that I forgot to mention.
Charles/Carl/Karl John/Johan Petersen had two siblings that we know of 1. Peter Emil/Emmel 2. Matilda.
Thank you |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 17:11:12
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Well this is a very well presented query, with a full name, birth date, possible birth location, father's name, siblings, and stated sources. Jkmarler has looked into it, without a clear candidate coming to light. I searched as well. So given the strength of the "starter" info, that's a sign this may be one of the tough ones.
Is there additional info you can add? Is he expected to have arrived as a seaman? What are his children's names? (Sometimes relevant...) His occupation? Is he known to have traveled directly to Syd Afrika from Norway? Did the known siblings emigrate, or stay in Norway? Did he ever return for a visit? What is the source of "Bragernes"? Where did the mother's maiden name come from (could be a corruption of a Norwegian farm name)? Are these handwritten sources with perhaps a problem in transcription (reading the handwriting)?
This Karl Johan had been living in America, now headed to South Africa:
https://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/gen/vis/8/pe00000000507781
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Edited by - JaneC on 12/01/2017 17:15:55 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 17:54:22
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| Another consideration would be the name. Even though the two possibles I posted appear to have adopted their father's patronymic as their surname in the census, it is still possible that they are recorded in other records differently named by their own patronymic paulusson or Paulson, Carlson / Karlson, Christenson, etc. |
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SLGous
Starting member
South Africa
8 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 19:04:27
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Hi JaneC,
I research name pattering in Norway and that is some weird stuff Petersen (son of Peter) and don't know what else :)
But in South Africa the name pattering works like this: (Charles and Margareta children)
1st born son gets his grandfathers name (from the father side) (Paul Arthur Petersen)
2nd born son gets his grandfathers names (from the mother side) (Peter Gabriel Petersen)
3rd born son gets his fathers names (Carl John Petersen) As this son got his dads names maybe this is the right spelling
4th born son gets eldest brothers name from fathers side (Peter Emil/Emmel Petersen) This is Charles/Carl/Karl eldest brothers names
5th born son gets eldest brothers name from mother side (Christian Johannes Petersen)
1st born daughter gets her grandmothers name (from the mother side) (Isabel)
2nd born daughter gets her grandmothers name (from the father side) (Peggy Elliott) No Pegiota, but maybe this was the mothers real name (Charles mother)
3rd born daughter gets her mothers names (Margreta Maria)
As for Charles/Carl/Karl siblings I have no idea if they stayed in Norway or also moved too South Africa, but I think (no evidence) that they stayed in Norway.
I will try and find extra information but this is what I have :(
The only thing I can think is that he disembarked at Durban (no evidence).
Thank you
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Edited by - SLGous on 12/01/2017 19:06:24 |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 20:32:45
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Many norwegians hunting whales in Antartic used Durban for "winterdwelling".
Was he a whaler?
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Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 12/01/2017 20:35:10 |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 21:00:07
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In this discussion is also Drammen or Brakerø in Buskerud county mentioned link
Kåre |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 22:37:06
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| Yes - Bergitta could equal Pergiota maybe |
Edited by - JaneC on 13/01/2017 00:03:05 |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2017 : 23:22:48
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quote:
Originally posted by lyndal40
The birth year for this Carl Johan is way off but the family is interesting because the father is named Paul Pedersen and there are three children Gunda Mathilde, Karl Johan, and Peder Emil and they live in Røyken near to Drammen, etc.
http://www.rhd.uit.no/folketellinger/ftliste_e.aspx?ft=1875&knr=0627&kenr=001&bnr=0007&lnr=00
Carl Johan Pedersen
in the Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927
Name: Carl Johan Pedersen
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 26 jul 1872
Baptism Date: 8 sep 1872
Baptism Place: Royken, Buskerud, Norway
Father: Poul Pedersen
Mother: Birgitte Gulliksdr
FHL Film Number: 1282537
Reference ID: 2:12SR2PH
Number 72
https://media.digitalarkivet.no/en/kb20061102330112
A very good candidate!
- The father is Paul Pederson
- Mother is Bergetta ("Pegiota")
- A sister named Mathilde
- A brother named Petter Emil
- Two more siblings according to census-1885: Aletta Emilie and Helga Marie.
A shame that the birthdate is so off!  The family has even moved to Bragenes by Census-1885. The father is Swedish.
Likely sisters Mathilde and Helga in Census-1900 Kristiania/Oslo.
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Edited by - jwiborg on 12/01/2017 23:50:32 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2017 : 02:53:02
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Has O.P. responded to the question about whether or not Carl Johan was a sailor or seafarer?
It might also be valuable to know the source for his birth date. |
Edited by - jkmarler on 13/01/2017 06:23:01 |
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SLGous
Starting member
South Africa
8 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2017 : 14:21:51
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Hi,
Wow thanks for all the information.
This could be him, I have his gravestone and amazingly no birth date or year, only death. Double checking with the family that also have the birth year that I do (on his death notice is also the year 1868 as his birth year)
I am still digging trying to find any extra information.
But I will try and link this Carl with the new dates and see maybe I can find something. If I can link this Carl to South Africa then I know its definitely him.
Thank you so much for everybody's help, I really do appreciate it a lot.
P.s JaneC the only thing I could find of occupation was also on his death notice but he was 83 years so it could have changed (occupation in life of the deceased - Prospector) |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2017 : 16:48:04
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quote:
Originally posted by SLGous
Born: 3 August 1868, Norway
Do I understand you to say that this date is not sourced in any South African record? |
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Petersen/Pedersen
