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SvenOlsen
Junior member
Netherlands
48 Posts |
 Posted - 18/01/2019 : 13:43:00
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Recently I have begun tracing the ancestry of me and my family and I have managed to track my ancestor back to Flosta, Aust-Agder. Atleast I think that I have, i'm about 90% sure.
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01038160003718
In The Netherlands I found a preserved wedding document and the parents are listed as: "Ole Terjesen" and "Anne Kirstine Johannesdochter" The latter is Dutch spelling however so it should be "Johannesdatter" The problem there is that Johannes doesn't seem to be a common name and I believe the correct Norwegian spelling should therefor be "Johansdatter"
If the above is true then the only difference between the name of the woman is that her last name is "Johnsdatter" not "Johansdatter" and that her second name is absent.
One might say well, if those names are close enough and the name of your ancestor matches, that should be fine. The problem is that my ancestor left Norway in the 50's 60's and came to The Netherlands, he married in 1860. The censuses in Norway were numerical in the decades before that, the earliest exception being 1815 I believe.
The reason that I believe that this is his family however is that the parents are old enough, both the sons also share the same profession. On the Dutch wedding document the parents are listed as living somewhere that I read as "Braarvik" or "Braasvik" And it happens to be that this family lives in the district of "Braarvig" Flougstad (Flosta) which is almost identical, i've checked all the other residents of this district in 1865 so to me it feels as if this has to be a match.
I have already assumed this to be true and i've done some more digging. I found a 1815 census of Flosta and on page 20 there is a family with a son named Ole Terjesen. The problem is that on the link above he is 61 which means that in 1815 he should have been 11. On the census of 1815 he is listed as 9 years old.
https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/51211/20
I cannot read Norwegian so it's rather difficult for me to search through things, especially in these scanned documents. I can only make out the names and ages but not other things that are written. I would be very grateful if someone could help me out.
I also think I found one of the sons of Ole Terjesen.
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01036551000971
Problem is that he should be a year older then he is listed on that link, which is discouraging.
That's about all I think, the name of my ancestor is "Terje Andreas Olsen" but he isn't listed anywhere with the exception of a church record that confirms his birth date at the 25th of May 1831 and him being baptised on the 26th of June 1831. He lists himself as having been born in "Flougstad Norway" on Dutch documentation. He used to be a sailor or "Matros" in Norwegian. My assumption is that he met a woman in The Netherlands, fell in love, married her and moved here. That's speculation though, all I know for sure is that he married her in 1860 in The Netherlands and raised a family in The Netherlands. |
Edited by - SvenOlsen on 18/01/2019 13:56:52 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 15:07:30
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The actual parish registers in Norway are the vital records of Norway. After a baptism might come a vaccination record and then at about age 15 a confirmation record. Usually but not always confirmation is attained before putting to sea. So to confirm your find you may want to search for a confirmation record.
So the Dutch records reflect that your ancestor's parents are Ole Terjesen and Anne Kirstine Johannesdatter. Is the birthdate or year in Dutch records as 25 May 1831?
So siblings would possibly be:
Name Carl Christian Olesen
Gender Male
Birth Date May 1837
Birthplace Dypvåg, Aust-Agder, Norway
Christening Date 15 May 1837
Christening Place Dypvåg, Aust-Agder, Norway
Father's Name Ole Torjesen
Mother's Name Anne Kirstine Johnsdr
Citing this Record
"Norway Baptisms, 1634-1927," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N757-LWG : 10 February 2018), Ole Torjesen in entry for Carl Christian Olesen, May 1837; citing Dypvåg, Aust-Agder, Norway; FHL microfilm 123,520.
actual baptism record #9 Carl Christian Olsen:
SAK, Dypvåg sokneprestkontor, F/Fb/Fbb/L0001: Parish register (copy) no. B 1, 1816-1850, p. 67
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070524310737
Probably brother Carl also on Braarvig in 1865:
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01038160003729
Name Anne Kirstine Olesdatter
Gender Female
Birth Date 29 Sep 1839
Birthplace Dypvåg, Aust-Agder, Norway
Christening Date 10 Nov 1839
Christening Place Dypvåg, Aust-Agder, Norway
Father's Name Ole Torjesen
Mother's Name Anne Kirstine Johnsdr
Citing this Record
"Norway Baptisms, 1634-1927," database, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N757-G88 : 10 February 2018), Ole Torjesen in entry for Anne Kirstine Olesdatter, 29 Sep 1839; citing Dypvåg, Aust-Agder, Norway; FHL microfilm 123,520.
#7 Therje Olsen birth / baptism:
SAK, Dypvåg sokneprestkontor, F/Fb/Fbb/L0001: Parish register (copy) no. B 1, 1816-1850, p. 45
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070524310715
#8 Terje Andreas Olsen Vatneboe confirmation:
SAK, Dypvåg sokneprestkontor, F/Fb/Fbb/L0001: Parish register (copy) no. B 1, 1816-1850, p. 269
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070524320124
#7 right hand page Terje Andreas Olsen Watneboe moving to Amsterdam:
SAK, Dypvåg sokneprestkontor, F/Fb/Fbb/L0002: Parish register (copy) no. B 2, 1851-1871, p. 168
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20070524320332
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Edited by - jkmarler on 18/01/2019 17:46:08 |
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SvenOlsen
Junior member
Netherlands
48 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 15:56:17
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Yes, he was born on the 25th of May 1831 and his place of birth is noted down as "Flougstad" which in the modern day would be a place called "Flosta". In the marriage documentation from 1860 it says the following: "Terje Andreas Olsen, sailor, born in Flougstad Norway. Living at ...... and 28 years old. Adult son of Ole Terjesen, farmer. And Anne Kirstine Johannesdochter. Living in Braarvik Norway" In the census data, Braarvik would apparantly be Braarvig and that is how I came upon the family I linked above.
You can probably not read Dutch but i'll link the documentation regardless. https://nha.blob.core.windows.net/scans/BS%20Huwelijk/Amsterdam/1860/NHA-H_ASD_1860_03_0038.jpg
A consistent problem for me remains that I simply cannot read Norwegian and that makes it more difficult for me to search through records. I can understand names and dates, but additional information I would not be able to read. In the 1865 census in the district of Braarvig, Flougstad there happened to be the family I found above. https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/district/tf01038160003623
Another difficulty for me was that Dypvåg and Flosta are listed as seperate places in Census options so i've been looking mostly for the "narrowed down" version which is Flougstad (Flosta) seeing as my ancestor noted that he's from there specifically. Though i'm unsure what would have been referred to as that area in his time.
From what you've linked me it seems as though my findings would be incorrect then. Could you possibly translate what else is being said on the Norwegian documentation that you linked? I don't know if its of interest but ideally i'd like to be able to find the place they lived and all his brothers/sisters and of course the parents as well. For the parents I have their names and nothing else if my previous findings are incorrect.
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Edited by - SvenOlsen on 18/01/2019 15:58:11 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 16:32:17
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I think the Terje links provided are exactly what you are after, especially the moving from the parish to Amsterdam record. Although the computer headline calls it Dypvaag the handwritten page heading identifies it as Flougstad.
Here is Wikipedia on Flosta:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flosta
Familysearch on Flosta particularly the record history of Flosta:
https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/213928?availability=Family%20History%20Library
Political geographic borders change a lot in Norway through history. It's like they are always tinkering trying to make better arrangements.
In the 1800s you are assisted by headings printed at the top of the pages. In the 1700s not so much. This might help you with English translations of the Norwegian page headings:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/ps-services-us-east-1-914248642252/s3/research-wiki-elasticsearch-prod-s3bucket/images/6/6e/Parish_Register_Headings_for_Norway.pdf
Reading the handwriting is different from reading the language. True I don't know Dutch but Zeeman seems like seaman to me and geburte sounds an awful lot like German geborn or geburts for birth. It's a nice record to see.
Typical Norwegian naming pattern is 1. Given name that you got at your baptism 2. Patronymic name which is created from your father's given name with the addition of son or datter depending on gender. 3. Farm name essentially an address of where you live. Watneboe or Vatneboe is a farm in Flosta.
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Edited by - jkmarler on 18/01/2019 17:17:04 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 17:12:26
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I think that Jackie has found a good candidate but ,I will add the information that is available on Ancestry.com for a Terje Andreas Olsen;. It seems to me that that there are some problems with these records especially the location of Haugstad, Radoy, Hordaland so we need to research a little further and see if these records are correct.
Terje Andreas Olsen
in the Netherlands, Civil Marriage Index, 1795-1950
Name: Terje Andreas Olsen
Gender: mannelijk (Male)
Age: 28
Birth Date: abt 1832
Marriage Date: 12 apr 1860
Marriage Place: Amsterdam
Father: Ole Terjesen
Mother: Anne Kirstina Johannesdochter
Spouse: Hendrika Johanna Hamersveld
Terje Andreas Olsen
in the Web: Netherlands, GenealogieOnline Trees Index, 1000-2015
Name: Terje Andreas Olsen
Gender: m (Male)
Birth Date: 25 mei 1831 (25 May 1831)
Birth Place: Haugstad, Radoy, Hordaland, Noorwegen
Death Date: 16 feb 1906
Death Place: Amsterdam, Noord-Holland, Nederland
Death Age: 74
Spouse: Hendrika Johanna van Hamersveld
Children: Elisabeth Maria Olsen
URL: https://www.genealogieonline.n..
As Jackie states below the above is a record from an online family tree. Here is a link that takes you there.
Link |
Edited by - AntonH on 19/01/2019 02:03:51 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 17:19:03
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| However Radoy Hordaland is not your Terje's birth place. Since that is from an online tree, perhaps it is not perfect but in the process of being perfected. |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 17:39:58
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quote:
Originally posted by SvenOlsen
I have already assumed this to be true and i've done some more digging. I found a 1815 census of Flosta and on page 20 there is a family with a son named Ole Terjesen. The problem is that on the link above he is 61 which means that in 1815 he should have been 11. On the census of 1815 he is listed as 9 years old.
https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/51211/20
Interesting that the family is counted on Watneboe. |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 17:40:46
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Trying to chase down the birth place given in the Family Tree does lead one on quite a journey. Using Family Search one finds that.
There is a Røldal parish, Information from Family Search
Røldal parish belonged to the Suldal clerical district in Rogaland county. It was separated from Suldal clerical district in 1885. The earlier records were burned in 1778. It became part of Hordaland County in 1848.
However there is no Terje born in May, 1831 in Røldal.
There is a Haugesund parish
While Haugesund is now in Hordaland Fylke (County) it was once in Rogaland a neighboring county. And in 1831 a part of Tovestad parish.
"Torvastad clerical district records began in 1753. They contain priest and sexton records from the parishes Torvastad and Utsira. Included Haugesund and Skåre until 1879."
A quick look at the three sub parishes for Torvestad in 1831 did not turn up any child born named Terje or for any child born in May, 1831.
I would have to conclude as Jackie already has that the Family Tree I posted a link to has an incorrect birth place.
I hope that the information in the Family Tree has not confused you.
I agree with Jackie that the Terje she found is very likely the person you are searching for. |
Edited by - AntonH on 18/01/2019 18:03:58 |
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SvenOlsen
Junior member
Netherlands
48 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 19:35:01
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I would like to say thank you to everyone that's helping me so far, I appreciate it a lot.
Looks like she did find the right Terje Andreas Olsen, I do not imagine that too many people with that name happened to be moving to Amsterdam at that time. I'm also excited to see that you've found the farm they lived on as well, the more information the better.
My biggest question at the moment would be regarding the wedding document that states that his parents are living at Braarvik in Norway, that seems to be Braarvig in the census records and the family I found before does match the names, district and place. So, would that be his family?
Also, regarding the family from 1815. If that's the same farm then that Ole Terjesen must surely be the father of Terje Andreas Olsen.
Edit: Found this just now, interesting though the last name is slightly different. https://www.geni.com/people/Ole-Torjesen-Vatnebu/6000000058867468902 |
Edited by - SvenOlsen on 18/01/2019 20:09:54 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 20:25:31
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The joke is that Norwegians are fluent in 8 languages these days, 7 of them are Norwegian. Each little place has its own dialect and Norwegian borrows some from Denmark since their 100s of years of rule. So certain letters are more or less interchangeable, g and k are a pair, i and j are a pair, v and w are a pair and so on. The Geni database appears to be the same family found in the 1815 census. Since there's a death date for Ole there, an estate record of the dødsfallsprotokol might be found in which survivors are named and located.
#45 left hand page
SAK, Dypvåg og Flosta lensmannskontor, F/Fe/L0001: Anmeldte dødsfall nr 72, 1870-1911
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/sk10411205116054
Unfortunately, doesn't mention the children, just that the widow lives and he is on social service and has left nothing.
The widow dies on 7 April 1892. #9 female lower half of page:
SAK, Dypvåg sokneprestkontor, F/Fa/Fab/L0001: Parish register (official) no. A 1, 1885-1912, p. 522-523
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20060531120484
#22 Ole Torjesen widow, poor person, Anne Kristine Johannesdatter
SAK, Dypvåg og Flosta lensmannskontor, F/Fe/L0001: Anmeldte dødsfall nr 72, 1870-1911
Brukslenke for sidevisning: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/sk10411205116058
No surviving children mentioned in her dødsfallprotokol either.
I was hoping that the records would list all the children by name and tell where they were at the time the parents died, thus creating another tie to Terje Andreas Olsen. But no children are mentioned at all.
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Edited by - jkmarler on 19/01/2019 02:30:08 |
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SvenOlsen
Junior member
Netherlands
48 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 20:30:13
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| Ah right, so the name difference is not too concerning then. I'll look for a dødsfallsprotokol later, now I just need to connect them to Terje Andreas Olsen. The Geni database sadly doesn't feature Terje Andreas. Do you know if the whole Braarvik/Braarvig thing holds up? Because the family in my initial post might be connected after all? |
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SvenOlsen
Junior member
Netherlands
48 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 21:20:25
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quote:
Originally posted by jkmarler
The joke is that Norwegians are fluent in 8 languages these days, 7 of them are Norwegian. Each little place has its own dialect and Norwegian borrows some from Denmark since their 100s of years of rule. So certain letters are more or less interchangeable, g and k are a pair, i and j are a pair, v and w are a pair and so on. The Geni database appears to be the same family found in the 1815 census. Since there's a death date for Ole there, an estate record of the dødsfallsprotokol might be found in which survivors are named and located.
#45 left hand page
SAK, Dypvåg og Flosta lensmannskontor, F/Fe/L0001: Anmeldte dødsfall nr 72, 1870-1911
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/sk10411205116054
Unfortunately, doesn't mention the children, just that the widow lives and he is on social service and has left nothing.
The widow dies on 7 April 1892. #9 female lower half of page:
SAK, Dypvåg sokneprestkontor, F/Fa/Fab/L0001: Parish register (official) no. A 1, 1885-1912, p. 522-523
Quick link: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/kb20060531120484
Interesting, the first link is difficult to read. Also, me not speaking Norwegian isn't helping. |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 22:17:55
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quote:
Do you know if the whole Braarvik/Braarvig thing holds up? Because the family in my initial post might be connected after all?
Yes, I think you can be fairly certain that the farm is called both Braarvik and Braarvig at various times. You can find the spelling Brarrvig in Digitalarkivet.com and in the list of farms for Flosta, Aust-Agder found in the Family Search site for Flosta it is spelled Braarvik
Here is some information for this family. Here is the marriage of the father of Ole Terjesen.
Torje Tostensen
in the Norway, Select Marriages, 1660-1926
Name: Torje Tostensen
Gender: Male
Marriage Date: 24 jun 1798
Marriage Place: Flosta, Aust-Agder, Norway
Spouse: Ane Kistine Olsdr
FHL Film Number: 123516
Reference ID: 2:1T3XXSP
Here is the original record.
First Record right hand page
#2
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Edited by - AntonH on 18/01/2019 23:29:15 |
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SvenOlsen
Junior member
Netherlands
48 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 23:18:22
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quote:
Originally posted by lyndal40
quote:
Do you know if the whole Braarvik/Braarvig thing holds up? Because the family in my initial post might be connected after all?
Yes, I think you can be fairly certain that the farm is called both Braarvik and Braarvig at various times. You can find the spelling Brarrvig in Digitalarkivet.com and in the list of farms for Flosta, Aust-Agder found in the Family Search site for Flosta it is spelled Braarvik
Here are some information for this family. Here is the marriage of the father of Ole Terjesen.
Torje Tostensen
in the Norway, Select Marriages, 1660-1926
Name: Torje Tostensen
Gender: Male
Marriage Date: 24 jun 1798
Marriage Place: Flosta, Aust-Agder, Norway
Spouse: Ane Kistine Olsdr
FHL Film Number: 123516
Reference ID: 2:1T3XXSP
Here is the original record.
First Record right hand page
#2
Ah thank you very much. I'm asking about Braarvig/Braarvik because I found a family in the first post of this thread, the first link. And I initially figured because in the wedding document it stated that they lived at Braarvik, Norway. Hence I am wondering if this family I found is the correct Ole Terjesen. It seems as if it's not based upon all the other things that were found? |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/01/2019 : 23:42:28
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quote:
I'm asking about Braarvig/Braarvik because I found a family in the first post of this thread, the first link. And I initially figured because in the wedding document it stated that they lived at Braarvik, Norway. Hence I am wondering if this family I found is the correct Ole Terjesen. It seems as if it's not based upon all the other things that were found?
Correct, your family is the one found by JKMarler as #7. father Ole Thorjesen Vatnebo. The marriage record I posted above is for the father and mother of Ole Thorjesen Vatnebo.
I am now thinking that they maybe the same family. In the baptism records they used the farm name of Vatnebo and in the 1865 Census they were living on the farm Braarvig. |
Edited by - AntonH on 19/01/2019 01:54:00 |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
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Help needed confirming ancestry
