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marymertz1
Starting member
USA
8 Posts |
 Posted - 27/01/2007 : 09:36:59
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| I have some info on Grethe, but almost nothing on her husband, John Idso, born in Stavanger in 1854 and immigrated to America around 1881. He died in Montana in 1931. I'm trying to find some siblings of his, and his parents. Any suggestions? I already tried ancestry.com. |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 27/01/2007 : 13:30:47
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In studying about Norwegian naming patterns - you've probably noticed that John's original "surname" was unlikely to be Idso. Check the 1865 Norwegian census database and you only find ONE person in all of Norway using that surname - and it isn't John.
But Idsøe/Idse island is not too far east from the city of Stavanger, in the district in 1865 called Strand, and that would be the first place I would think to look for young John in 1865. What did the middle initial M stand for? Possibly Michel/MIchelsen/Mikkelsen?
A young man called Johan Mikkelsen, born about 1854 lives with his mother on one of the Idsøe island farms --
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=5&filnamn=f61130&gardpostnr=321&sokefelt=skjul
Research into the parish records of Strand parish in Rogaland for Johan's birth/baptism should give you the name of his father. Those same parish records may give you information about his parents and any possible other children born to that couple. It is possible that the boy was taken to Stavanger for his baptism - but I'd think it far more likely you should check in the records of his birth parish first.
If you haven't already, be sure to study the helpful articles and helps about reading and using the Norweigan records which you will find in the LINKS from this website.
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marymertz1
Starting member
USA
8 Posts |
Posted - 27/01/2007 : 21:47:07
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| Thank you! I was wondering why I kept hitting a brick wall! I knew he had to come from somewhere!! I will have fun trying to "dig up" his father! |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2007 : 01:01:36
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Could it be this one?
Carl Johan Mikkelsen
Birth: 27 JUL 1854
Christening: 10 SEP 1854, Qvelvaagnaes, Strand, Rogaland
Parents: Michel Torkildsen & Gjertrud Larsdatter
Kvalvåg is a neighbouring farm to Idse.
Jan Peter |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2007 : 01:13:24
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Looks like his father had second thoughts and married Marte Thormodsdatter instead... 
Jan Peter |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2007 : 12:46:20
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The island farms of Idse and Idsal are also included in a three volume work of history/genealogy entitled "Folk i Strand : ei gards- og ættesoge" by Jan Alsvik. Idse, Idsal and Kvalvåg farms are all in the vol. 3 of those books. You can find publication details about those Norwegian books through the online LDS library catalog at www.familyseach.org
You may want to read again through the special help about getting that type of book through Inter-Library Loan
http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~norway/articles.html
I also saw those three books on the shelves of the Salt Lake City Famly History Library just last week. |
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marymertz1
Starting member
USA
8 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2007 : 19:15:31
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quote:
Originally posted by jwiborg
Looks like his father had second thoughts and married Marte Thormodsdatter instead...
Jan Peter
0
It's kind of a mystery. It's been told in the family down the decades that John's father was "Mike Idsa" and his mother was "Gesfew Larson". Looking down that road kept getting me nowhere. Then this site has opened another door! The site that Hopkins had showed Gjertrud Larsdotter was unmarried and had a son, Johan Mikkelson. She was a lodger on the Idso farm. Maybe Mikkel didn't marry Gjertrud even though she was pregnant? Or maybe he was already married? Hmmmm. This happens all the time in the US nowadays, unfortunately, but not so often in the 1850s, did it? This is getting more interesting as it goes...thank all of you for the "digging" for me. I don't know any Norwegian and am doing this for my mother-in-law. Her grandfather was John "Idso" but if his mother wasn't married, no wonder he left for America and a "new life." I bet Johan never dreamed people 150 years later would care about his father and mother! |
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marymertz1
Starting member
USA
8 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2007 : 19:21:34
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Ah, ha
After looking up the info about Marte, it seems that Mikkel and Marte had a daughter around 1854, and Mikkel and Gjertrud had a son in 1854 with Mikkel, too. Hmmm. |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 28/01/2007 : 22:26:07
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Mikkel & Marte's daughter Anne Christine Mikkelsdatter is born 21 SEP 1855, so you could possibly say that he was on the "safe" side...
Mikkel Torkildsen (31) & Marthe Thormodsdatter (23) got married on 11 APR 1855.
Jan Peter |
Edited by - jwiborg on 28/01/2007 22:34:34 |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 29/01/2007 : 00:33:46
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People's behaviour hasn't changed at all. These things happened - and they still happen. Just human nature.
Under the "Links" you'll also find a couple of excellent translating word lists. Read, study and keep the "bookmarks" or "favorite places" available for quick reference.
Personal advice - NEVER count on Norwegian spelling. Think 'sounds like' and be generous with what the spelling might be from document to document. Standardized spelling is a very very modern invention. If John pronounced his mother's name something like 'Gesfew' you have to wonder who wrote it down for him.
This is the first time you've made mention of "Mike" - that would have been helpful from the beginning. |
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marymertz1
Starting member
USA
8 Posts |
Posted - 29/01/2007 : 01:19:27
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| Sorry about not putting in Mike in there. I've been looking up all weekend and this is the first time I haven't mentioned him and the ONLY time I seem to be finding anything. Go figure... Thank you so much for all the help. I'm very grateful. |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 29/01/2007 : 15:50:35
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It was only last week that I was looking for the Idse island/farm for unrelated research in a time period about 150 years earlier than what you were seeking. Only because I had been dealing with it so recently did it quickly come to mind when I read your posting.
Here's a rough map of Rogaland on which you can locate Idse island -
http://www.rootsweb.com/~norway/rogaland.html
You see the city of Stavanger? Just to the right, where the R in the word Stavanger finishes - THAT is Idse island. Slightly smaller island, Idsal is between Idse and the location of Kvalvåg on the pennisula south of Jørpeland. (Notice that body of water between is called Idsefjorden?)
Good luck - with study of the 'how-to' materials I've mentioned previously - you and/or your in-laws should be able to trace back quite a family tree. That area has a great deal of history. |
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marymertz1
Starting member
USA
8 Posts |
Posted - 30/01/2007 : 02:01:09
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| Why was that area called "Idso?" I remember when you said that only one person had the surname of Idso in the 1865 'census' and it wasn't a John. How do you know whom is related to whom if they can call themselves anything?! Grethe, his fiance, came over to America and instead of Grethe Gabrielsdotter, her name, she called herself Grethe Melling and the other family members that came to the US called themselves Hill. Its' hard to do Norwegian family trees! |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 30/01/2007 : 04:15:33
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Why called Idse/Idsø/Idso? why not? why is Peoria called Peoria?... you'd have to study in the area's history to find out, I sure don't know. I concentrate on genealogy not on geographic history. I'm sure the information is available - you just have to find it.
You don't appear to be reading or studying at all in the materials I've been assuming that you were looking at to get started. It ISN'T hard to do Norwegian genealogy. It ISN'T HARD at all!! Just a little different, because of the patronymic naming system -- that is easily mastered with a little study and logic.
Study about Norwegian naming patterns - study about using the many many Norwegian historical documents which are easily available and useable.
Read, study, apply!!!!
My instinct tells me that Grethe Gabrielsdtr Meling was also from the general area of Stavanger; Meling (and similar spelling variations are fairly common farm names in that area).
Norwegians calling themselves Hill in the US? I've seen it before. But that was an American surname that was NOT Norwegian in origin - the families I tracked earlier had adapted it from a farm originally meaning 'hill' in the Norwegian language. We don't have enough information to be able to know if that was true for the people you have in your family.
Start reading and studying -
http://www.familysearch.org (Research Helps - Norway - Research outline)
http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~norway/articles.html
http://www.norwayheritage.com/articles/templates/genealogy.asp?articleid=2&zoneid=2
You'll find a great deal more is available -
http://www.cyndislist.com/norway.htm
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 30/01/2007 : 08:40:54
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Grethe Amalie Gabrielsdatter (5) on the Meling farm in Hetland parish, Rogaland in census 1865. Parents are Gabriel Johannessen & Oline Lambretsdatter.
Jan Peter |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
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John M Idso and Grethe Gabrielsdotter Melling
