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KnudsonFamily
Medium member
USA
186 Posts |
 Posted - 21/05/2010 : 20:43:11
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Rock Church Cemetery has a listing for Ole Nelson 1806 -1863 note: Skjeinhuus?
Ole Nelson Marker |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 21/05/2010 : 20:52:24
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I bet that is him. Kjemhuus is the farm, where do see the note for Skjeinhuus? It is obviously very close. The birthdate is dead on -- although that part of Rollag church books does not show birthdates, he was baptized, May 11, 1806.
I think Ragnil has died between 1870-1880. Ole may be "lost" to us for more info, no funeral records, obituary unlikely at that time. (Though sometimes I can find at least a line in the newspaper.) |
Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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KnudsonFamily
Medium member
USA
186 Posts |
Posted - 21/05/2010 : 21:17:04
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the listing came from second hand source. Notes are supposed to be from Gerhard Nĉseth
Could be related to sailing out of Skien
interestingly, 1850 census link that Kċarto posted has the same Skjeinhuus quote:
4770 Ole Nelson 44 m none Norway 177 Dodgeville Iowa Wisconsin Ole Nielsen Skjeinhuus, utv. 1839
4771 Rangal Haldasatter 36 f Norway 177 Dodgeville Iowa Wisconsin Ragnild Halvorsdtr, utv. 1839
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Edited by - KnudsonFamily on 21/05/2010 21:35:15 |
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Kċarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 21/05/2010 : 21:21:18
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The closest I can get to Petnes in Norway is Peternes, Finmark County, unlikely.
Otnes is a farm in Sellĝ parish, Sogn & Fjordane county.
A supplemet, Norwegians in the US 1850 census, contains more than 30 000 names, an example:
Ole Nerisen Kjerre, wife Aasne, son Neri and two daugters Ragnild and Ingeborg em. 1848 from Veggli.
Kċre |
Edited by - Kċarto on 21/05/2010 21:35:02 |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 21/05/2010 : 21:34:21
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| I think it has to be Otnes, I can see the name some in the area. The will was written in handwriting of the clerk into the book, so there are several places for him to have misunderstood. You can see misunderstanding is a BIG problem. However, we can probably assume that Ole C. and the other Norwegians knew who he meant. |
Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 22/05/2010 : 22:29:03
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I have been working a little more on Mary Otnes. Mary Otnes: Note in 1885 Minn. state census Ole Halverson was living with Emes or Enes O. and Mary Otnes family in Hector Twp., and their child Oscar, 2. E.O. Otnes and Mary Otnes, both b. Norway, had child May Dorttua born 20 May 1885, in Hector Twp. birth records (under 1885 #16). Son of Ole, Ole M. Halverson, died at the residence of A.O. Otnes, July 14, 1888, in Hector, of consumption, according to his short obituary in Renville County Union, (Bird Island), July 20, 1888, p. 1., col. 3. Emos Otnes, b. May 1850 Norway, a widower, found in 1900 census in Bandon, Renville County, boarder with Nestadte family, immigrated 1871 (E.D. 118, Sheet 1A, line 17).
No children see in 1900 census with Emos. In 1905 Minn. state census, can see Amos or Ames Otnes, 55, with May, 20, and Almer, 18, in Hector Village in Renville Couny (E.D. 9, image 30, lines 18-20). There are other Otnes families in Renville County.
My theory is Ole and Ole M lived with Mary & her husband for a time, including while Ole M. was dying, and possibly while Ole's wife Mary was dying, and was helped by Mary Otnes. Possibility that Mary Otnes contracted tuberculosis and died; or died of other causes. Mary Otnes's children were farmed out to other families after she died, until they were older and could live with Emos/Amos.
And, I see some death certificates in Minn. for Amos and for Oscar that match their birth years.
I do not think Mary Otnes is Ole's daughter, but we can check Oscar's death certificate to see if it has mother's name on it.
I also do not think Ole had a son-in-law Nels Nordquist or Norquist - I think that might be a stepson, that Mary his second wife was a widow, and her adult son visited or lived with them for a time.
The child Ally born 1858 in 1875 census, I think is really Halstein's son, the birth date is exactly the same, and the name Ally is a little unusual, uncommon enough to have two children exactly same age with same name. You can see Ole Halverson and his first wife Ann in 1860 census, they have no children. But they are right there with his sister Liv and her husband Gilbert Olson, mistakenly written as Halverson. I think Ally has gone west to see his uncle, or even moved with him.
The Norwegians all take care of each other, so I can really see Mary helping Ole, even taking him in as he has no one, and Ole feeling very bad later when she dies. Also, I think Ole and Ann like to have children around, in 1860 census the neighbor's child is visiting -- or perhaps Ann takes care of her part of the time, for it looks like Emeline Nelson has lost her mother, she has only her father, and her grandmother of the same name, age 60.
So Ole has rather a sad story. His first wife died, perhaps they have lost some babies in there, his only surviving son from his second marriage died when he was 20. He leaves his farm to his nephew. From Halstein's America letter, it seems like Halstein was especially eager to have Ole come.
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Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 22/05/2010 : 22:34:48
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Downer/ Downing
I am very intrigued by the fact that Ragnil and her husband Ole Nielsen may have lived in Du Page County in 1840, and Pierce Downer is on the same census page. It is very difficult to find Norwegians in 1840, yet we have a name, place and ages that seem right. Age of one male is correct range for Ole, age of female is correct range for Ragnil; and the age of the 2nd male would fit Halstein quite nicely. And, their first daughter, Mary, was born in Illinois.
Nothing can be proved, but can't help wondering... |
Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 22/05/2010 : 23:50:09
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Otnes
Saved myself a trip to Minn. Historical Society -
Found in Minn. marriages: Mae D. Otnes to John H. Bye 14 July 1925 Hennepin; Oscar A. 01 Dec 1909 Renville to Berenice Enger; Elmer Edward 22 June 1925 Renville to Elsie Melvine Scott;
in Minn. deaths: Mae Dorothy Bye b. 11 May 1885 Minn, d. 16 Dec. 1967 Kandiyohi, mother's maiden name Olson; Oscar A. Otnes b. 13 April 1883 Minn. d. 19 Aug. 1963 Otter Tail, mother's maiden name unknown; Elmer Edward Otness, b. 04 Oct. 1887 Minn. d. 10 April 1963 Brown Co., mother's maiden name Olson.
The date for Mae or May in May birthdate is off 9 days, but maybe in book was recording date, the records were pretty sloppy. The others match well. But 2 death records identify mother's maiden name in the Minn. Death Index as Olson.
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Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Kċarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 23/05/2010 : 00:36:02
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1860 census Dodgeville.
90-90 (Sector?)
- Alston Halverson 45 Blacksmith Norway
- Mary Halverson 31 Norway
- Mary 10 Wis
- Albert 8 Wis
- Carill 4 Wis
- Ally 2 Wis
- Josephine G. 2. Wis
With him lives John Evensen 37 and Lewis Lewison (Leiv Leivsen) both born in Norway
347-347
same census Dodgeville, Gilbert Olsen and Liv Halvorsdatter with 8 children, Value of real estate 3000, value of personal estate 300 .
Ole Halvorsen (same sector as Gilberty and Liv) 43 farmer and Ann 39, no children. Value of real estate 500. Value of personal estate 1000.
1850 Dodgeville Ole Halbvorsen and Ann had Emeline Nelson 8, Irish, living with them.
Kċre |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 23/05/2010 : 04:11:28
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That name is really Carrie if you can see the image (I can send it to you, if you need it).
Emeline Nelson, 8, born Wis. (Wisconsin, it is not Ireland) is not necessarily living with Ole and Ann -- the census taker writes down everyone there that day. The next family is Nelse Nelson, 24, born Norway, farmer, claim, and, and Emeline Nelson, 60, born Norway. It looks to me like Nels named his daughter after his mother, Emeline Nelson, and that his wife has died. Therefore, Emeline spends perhaps part or most of the time at the neighbors. Ole and Ann may be very happy to have a child there part of the time. Perhaps Nels will remarry. :-) |
Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Kċarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 23/05/2010 : 10:09:18
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I see, so everyone beeing on the farm that day was written down.
I enlarged it and read Wis not Iris (Irish), the W confused me, nice handwriting by the ass´t Marshal.
Kċre |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 23/05/2010 : 18:18:13
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Yes, that is correct. That is why it can seem, when the relationships are not identified in the earlier census, so confusing about who is who. Of course cousins will come to play that day or are helping around the farm, family members are coming and going. If you work with a lot of American census, you will sometimes find the same person enumerated twice in different places -- maybe visiting his brother one day and on his own farm when a different census taker comes by another day.
I always feel that people are doing the same then as we would do, so sometimes I am thinking what is the story for this this? So I look at the 1870 census for Ragnil, for example, and see an elderly lady and a young girl named Olson along with all Ragnil's children. I see Ragnil's daughter Mary is there and what is obviously Mary's 4-month-old baby. I see lots of Olsons in two families on the same page, with children. I think the old lady and the young girl are really part of those families. I think , maybe Mary comes to visit her mother with her baby; Ragnil, now a grandmother, invites the other grandmother from the next farm to see the baby, and she brings her granddaughter. The grandmothers get to spend some time playing with the baby. I don't know that is what happened, and maybe later I will see a connection with the Olson family.
The census takes are very human, just like the rest of us. They misunderstand and make mistakes. In Minneapolis, we have many immigrants from southeast Asia and from Somalia right now. Sometimes we don't always understand what they said, and we don't know how to spell it. Since we can't say some of their names, they shorten it up to something else more American. Of course, now we struggle with what the census takers did!
On 1870 census for Halstein, I have a little idea of what might have happened. Look at the family before his. The name of the man is -- Holstein! He is from Prussia. I wonder if the census taker has gotten it mixed up, the Prussian man should be Benjamin. (My little story -- we know Halstein is the blacksmith, he is IN the town. The men, including the census taker, are standing around in the yard of the smithy, talking. Oops!)
People will always be human -- it looks to me like Mary, Halstein's daughter, is born 5 months after the wedding. :-) That Halstein, he is a charming fellow. |
Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Kċarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 23/05/2010 : 23:39:50
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Hi,
people has not changed over the centuries.
Immediately when I read about Halstein Flĝse in the local newspaper and his letter I realized we had to do with an extraordinary youth.
It was not without reason the Nattestad´s took Halstein with them.
There were three brave young men who went to America 1837.
When they realized everyone could make the dream of owning his own farm they decided to share the joy with family and friends in Veggli and Rollag.
When Ansten Nattestad returned he orginized the 1839 journey with more than 100 persons from Veggli in addition to the two Telemark parties, the Lonar party from Hjartdal and the Rue party from Tinn.
There is no evidence that Ansten earned as much as a Cent on this trip, the purpose seems to have been only to help others.
Kċre |
Edited by - Kċarto on 23/05/2010 23:42:25 |
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Linda Tollefson Therkelse
Junior member
USA
62 Posts |
Posted - 24/05/2010 : 00:12:59
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I really agree! I believe they are all such a remarkable group, very brave, led by a man who seems only to bring his people to a dream they could not have met in Norway.
So it is sad sometimes when the dreams cannot always be met, even if it is the human way..
The Nattestads did very well in Wisconsin, but I found this sad when I visited in Rock County: the two brothers are buried in different cemeteries. They have been divided in the splitting of the Jefferson Prairie church. |
Linda Tollefson Therkelsen |
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Rachel Gibson
New on board
USA
2 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2010 : 04:31:58
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Halsten Halvorsen Flĝse's wife Mari... I sent for a copy of the marriage certificate and I'm wondering how it was determined that she's from Dane County, WI. I have a Mari Aslaksdtr (b. 2 Sep 1830) who immigrated in 1843 (#193) and has family buying land in Dane County around the time of Halsten's marriage. If I'm following correctly, Halsten's wife died between 1880 and 1885, likely in Renville County, MN. Has anyone found a date of death or gravestone?
Was Ansten Nattestad's wife Kari the one born 7 Nov 1820?
When did Ansten Nattestad die? I have a copy of a funeral card for "A.K. Natesta" who died 8 Apr 1888 "75 years, 7 mo., 13 days".
-Rachel
Eden Prairie, Minnesota |
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The first "Amerika-brev"
