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DavidE Olsen
Starting member
USA
20 Posts |
 Posted - 17/02/2017 : 19:02:11
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Just to throw more fuel on the fire here, if they named children after farms here's an example of a guy named vigo kristian krog with a mother whose maiden name was Olsen? Birth date doesn't match but is it possible we are looking for Olaf in Vega and should be looking for maybe a farm Vigo?
Name: Vigo Peder Kristian Jensen Krog
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 31 jul 1881
Baptism Date: 4 sep 1881
Baptism Place: Strømm, Vestfold, Norway
Father's Age: 14 Apr 1841
Mother's Age: 24 Jun 1839
Father: Thomas Jensen Krog
Mother: Olava Mathilde Olsen
FHL Film Number: 127644
Reference ID: B3 p113 #40 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 17/02/2017 : 19:17:59
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| Vigo is a true male first name, sometimes Viggo. Think of Viggo Mortenson, the actor. |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 17/02/2017 : 20:23:48
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It's good to be thinking outside the box, though.
In traditional naming, parents didn't name children after farms. A child had a first name and a patronym (father's first name + sen or + datter). Most people lived on farms. Many names repeated. To be clear, one would refer to "Peter Larsen on Xfarm." If Peter moved to Y farm, one might mention "Peter Larsen on Yfarm." Same man, different farm address. If Krog is a farm name, your Olaf could be called Olaf Olsen, Olaf Olsen Krog, or Olaf Krog. In America immigrants conformed by choosing one last name passed down as a last name. It could be a patronym but some immigrants used a farm name. Often an immigrant gradually adjusted his idea of what his name was. Many who used a place name retained their patronym as a middle name or middle initial.
Partly because of the transitory nature of farm "names," it is unclear how the name "Grandma Krogg" relates to Olaf himself. So far we have no documentation of that name as applied to HIM. The name might be an essential identifier - or a mistake about the names Olaf himself had. |
Edited by - JaneC on 18/02/2017 14:10:10 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/02/2017 : 02:36:32
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quote:
i wasn't aware that Olaf and Olivia got divorced but it appears they did, i'm not sure about the 1930 census for Olivia being correct as her middle name is Maria not "C" and she was born October 19, 1869 not 1875 but i know sometimes census info can be transcribed wrong. She was born in Vasa Finland so there are many things correct on this census. dav
Olivia used the initial C many time s in the records found for her including this one.
Olivia C Olsen
in the U.S., Social Security Applications and Claims Index, 1936-2007
Name: Olivia C Olsen
[Olivia C Berg]
SSN: 573306584
Gender: Female
Race: White
Birth Date: 19 Oct 1870
Birth Place: Vasa, Finland
Father: Carl Berg
Mother: Marie Neugard
Type of Claim: Original SSN.
Notes: Mar 1943: Name listed as OLIVIA C OLSEN
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Edited by - AntonH on 18/02/2017 16:30:28 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 18/02/2017 : 13:42:00
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So re the parents of the Olivia C Berg in this thread, we need to say it loud and clear:
Her parents were NOT Gustav Braut Anund Berg and Hulda Augusta Melin, residents of southern Sweden.
This writer (on the link) says the daughter of Gustaf and Hulda was born in August (not October) and married Gunnar Alexander Ulrik:
link
We don't need to confirm the identity of the Swedish girl, because the research here already rules her out. |
Edited by - JaneC on 18/02/2017 15:19:23 |
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DavidE Olsen
Starting member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 19/02/2017 : 20:42:02
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So did some digging and found the article referencing him changing his name to Olsen from Krog, again just an article. But i also found the birth certificate for my Grandfather Einar that has some different names and birth dates. As i still can figure out if and how to post an image here's the info:
Eureka Calif, Gaynor's Sanitorium and Private Hospital
Sept 12, 1907
Ainer Oliver Olsen(even Einar spelled different)
Father Olaf Carl Olsenness(abbrev to Olsen)
Age at last birthday 32(1875 or 1876?)
Born in Norway
Mother Maiden Olive Barch
Age at last birthday 36
Born in Finland
The article on Krog is from the Argus Courier, Petaluma CA, Dec 4, 1985
Title In Search of Einar Olsen
By Bill Soberanes
Guy writing book and looking for him was Harold D Huycke, Edmonds, Wash.
Sorry i can't post, i noticed there is a post image button but when i select it it doesn't do anything?
thanks, Dave
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 19/02/2017 : 22:28:46
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This may be the Harold Huycke:
Harold D. Huycke Jr.
WA United States
Captain Harold D. Huycke Jr. Captain Harold D. Huycke Jr., 84, born November 23, 1922, in Sapulpa, Oklahoma, died February 12, 2007, in Edmonds, Washington. His family moved to Los Angeles, California, in 1930 where Harold graduated from University High School. He attended Occidental College for two years, then graduated from the California Maritime Academy in 1944 and USC in 1947. He went to sea in the Merchant Marine on Liberty and Victory ships in the Pacific during and following WWII. In 1952 he married Alice Marguerite Frost of Birmingham, Alabama. They returned to the west coast where he worked ashore in San Francisco and Tacoma with Weyerhaeuser Steamship Company. During these years his three children were born. In 1957, as he often said, "I got the best job I ever had." Capt. Huycke was hired by the State of California to purchase and overhaul the three-masted wooden schooner, C.A. Thayer. He served as bosun on its historic final voyage from Puget Sound to San Francisco where it currently resides as part of the SF Maritime Museum. The next dozen years were spent in a variety of shore-side and seagoing jobs, alternately working in Seattle, Hawaii, Mexico, and Central America as a cargo superintendent and going to sea as mate and master in the company's ships. Capt. Huycke retired after 18 years as a self-employed marine surveyor, during which time he was hired to survey cargo, big and small ships, commodities, drafts, U.S Navy wooden minesweepers, fishing boats of all sizes, and yachts. Next to his family, his greatest passion was researching sailing ships, steam schooners, shipbuilding, and the sea-going experiences of the men who sailed on those ships. Over a span of nearly 70 years, he collected oral histories and exchanged thousands of letters with hundreds of former sailors scattered all over the globe. His passion for preserving this segment of maritime history led him to active involvement in maritime museums and historical societies throughout the world. Harold founded the North American section of the international society of Cape Horners. He published one book, To Santa Rosalia, Further and Back and innumerable articles on maritime history. He never turned down a request for information and assisted countless other authors with their research, writing and publishing efforts. Harold sang for many years with the Seattle SeaChordsmen and the Edmonds United Methodist Church choir. He enjoyed playing the ukulele and singing cowboy songs and composing humorous poems for his family. Capt. Huycke was preceded in death by his parents, Harold D. Huycke and Mary Isabel Work Huycke; and his brother, David. He is survived by his wife of 54 years, Marguerite; children D,avid (Mary) Huycke II, of Yakima, Washington, Arthur (Beth) Huycke, of Seattle, Washington, and Rebecca (Drew) Ellison, of Everett; grandchildren, David, Gregory, Rosalie Ellison and Anna Huycke; and step-grandsons, Tyler and Ben Sellon. A service celebrating Harold's life will be held at 11 a.m., Friday, February 23, 2007, at Edmonds United Methodist Church, 828 Caspers Street, Edmonds. In lieu of flowers, donations may be made to Providence Hospice of Snohomish County, 2731 Wetmore Avenue #500, Everett, WA 98201 or The Millionair Club 2515 Western Avenue, Seattle, WA 98121. |
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DavidE Olsen
Starting member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 19/02/2017 : 23:55:14
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[quote]Originally posted by JaneC
It's good to be thinking outside the box, though.
In traditional naming, parents didn't name children after farms. A child had a first name and a patronym (father's first name + sen or + datter). Most people lived on farms. Many names repeated. To be clear, one would refer to "Peter Larsen on Xfarm." If Peter moved to Y farm, one might mention "Peter Larsen on Yfarm." Same man, different farm address. If Krog is a farm name, your Olaf could be called Olaf Olsen, Olaf Olsen Krog, or Olaf Krog. In America immigrants conformed by choosing one last name passed down as a last name. It could be a patronym but some immigrants used a farm name. Often an immigrant gradually adjusted his idea of what his name was. Many who used a place name retained their patronym as a middle name or middle initial.
Partly because of the transitory nature of farm "names," it is unclear how the name "Grandma Krogg" relates to Olaf himself. So far we have no documentation of that name as applied to HIM. The name might be an essential identifier - or a mistake about the names Olaf himself had.
In the link you sent Jane it had this:
The most common pattern was adding the farm name, or 'address'. Let's use the example mentioned above. If Jon Anderssen settled on a farm called Bakken, he would be called Jon Anderssen Bakken, that is: Jon Anderssen, who lives at Bakken. If he moved to a farm called Vik, his full name would change to Jon Anderssen Vik.
Does this mean it could be Olaf Christian, Kristian, or maybe even Carl Krog Vigo?
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 20/02/2017 : 00:16:52
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More likely to be
Olaf Christian Kristiansen i.e. First name Olaf middle name Christian and father named Kristian.
Carl Vigo Krog ie First name Carl middle name Vigo and who lived on the farm named Krog
Middle names are common enough in Norway and there are many examples of Vigo as a middle name. |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 20/02/2017 : 19:22:45
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quote:
Originally posted by DavidE Olsen
[quote][i]
Does this mean it could be Olaf Christian, Kristian, or maybe even Carl Krog Vigo?
I agree with Anton that Olaf seems unlikely ever to have had the name to Carl Krog Vigo.
I didn't understand what was written on Einar's birth record as Olaf's name. Were the words "abbreviated to Olsen" written on the record - or is that a comment added by you? Does Einar's birth record include "...ness"?
You wrote: "Olaf Carl Olsenness (abbrev to Olsen)
Are you looking at a transcription - or at a copy of the original record?
"Carl" was the name of Olivia's father, so one wonders if the Carl in Olaf's name is a transcription error or some kind of error...
Do you have a copy of Harold's birth record (about 1905)?
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Edited by - JaneC on 20/02/2017 22:26:12 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 20/02/2017 : 21:36:23
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An Ole Adolph Krog was born in Vega, Nordland, in 1878 - wrong boy, but interesting that the name Krog appears:
link |
Edited by - JaneC on 20/02/2017 21:37:26 |
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DavidE Olsen
Starting member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 20/02/2017 : 22:04:48
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So found an Ole born on 16 Sep 1879, in Dovre, Oppland, Norway, parents, Mikkel Olsen and Kristine Sivertsdr, also found a town in Dovre called Vågå so was wondering if you think Vågå was a possibility for Vigoe? Here's the info:
Vågå (Norwegian pronunciation: [#712;#651;o#720;#712;#609;o#720;]) is a municipality in Oppland county, Norway. It is part of the traditional region of Gudbrandsdal.
Two origins have been suggested for the name Vågå:
The name Vågå may come from the Old Norse word vega meaning "travel". The area lies on an ancient east-west route mentioned in the Heimskringla.
The Old Norse form of the name may come from Vaga (accusative and dative cases) from the word Vagi (nominative case). It was probably originally the name of the lake Vågåvatn, but the meaning is unknown. (Maybe derived from vage which means "sleigh runner" since the shape of the lake has some similarity of form with a sleigh runner.)[2]
Prior to 1918, the name was written "Vaage". In 1918, it was changed to "Vaagaa" and in 1921 the spelling was again changed to "Vågå". The letter å is a long vowel similar to "oh" or "aw", like in the American pronunciation of "cold" or "oar.
Name: Ole
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 16 sep 1879
Christening Date: 25 sep 1879
Christening Place: Dovre, Oppland, Norway
Father: Mikkel Olsen
Mother: Kristine Sivertsdr |
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DavidE Olsen
Starting member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 20/02/2017 : 22:14:02
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quote:
Originally posted by JaneC
[quote]Originally posted by DavidE Olsen
[quote][i]
Does this mean it could be Olaf Christian, Kristian, or maybe even Carl Krog Vigo?
To build on what Anton wrote...No, Olaf is not likely to have the name Carl Krog Vigo.
The male given name "Viggo" does not apply, so I guess you are asking whether the birthplace Olaf stated on his naturalization papers ("Vigoe") could be used at the end of a name like a farm address is used. I don't recall an immigrant ever stating a farm address as a birth place when filling out information about himself in his adopted country. Usually the birth place is a town or city, a parish, a traditional region (e.g. Helgeland) or a topographical term (e.g., an island or a valley). A farm is too specific - it would be like Einar declaring that hospital as his birthplace, rather than saying he was born in Eureka or California. So, I don't think "Vigoe" is a farm, but that is just my thoughts. We don't know for sure yet what "Vigoe" meant.
I didn't understand what was written on Einar's birth record as Olaf's name. Were the words "abbreviated to Olsen" written on the record - or is that a comment added by you? Does Einar's birth record include "...ness"?
You wrote: "Olaf Carl Olsenness (abbrev to Olsen)
Are you looking at a transcription - or at a copy of the original record?
"Carl" was the name of Olivia's father, so one wonders if the Carl in Olaf's name is a transcription error or some kind of error...
Do you have a copy of Harold's birth record (about 1905)?
I have a copy of the actual birth certificate for Einar, the record really says Olaf Carl Olsenness(abbrev to Olsen). I know Olaf's accent was pretty thick and maybe even Olivia's so maybe it was a case of what was translated, it was typed in the certificate.
I don't have Harold's from 1905 but i'm guessing the same hospital so i'll look for it and see what it says.
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
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DavidE Olsen
Starting member
USA
20 Posts |
Posted - 20/02/2017 : 22:35:25
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Doing some digging on Harold, looking for birth certificate but here's his social security info, he does have both Carl and Olaf in his name:
Name: Harold Carl Olaf Olsen
Gender: M (Male)
Birth Date: 24 Dec 1905
Birth Place: USA
Death Date: 11 Jun 1962
Father: Olaf Christian Olsen
Mother: Olivia Maria Berg
Spouse: Maxine J Olsen(Means is maiden name) |
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Help locating Olaf C. Olsen or Krog
