Author |
Topic |
|
loyane
Junior member
Germany
73 Posts |
Posted - 17/04/2021 : 18:39:04
|
Dear Listers!
Another big challenge for you today, which has rested on my desk for more than 40 years:
Johannes Torkildson Ronnei/Kalhagen (1832-1914) and Ingeborg Andersdotter Hunshammer (1830-1901) farmed for a few years the Kalhagen farm in Luster County, but later became «husmannsfolk» at Hesjebakken under the neighboring Ronnei farm. They lived and died in Norway. However, they had two sons who have disappeared in America:
* Dyre Johannesson Ronnei/Kalhagen, born in Luster Co., Norway June 6, 1859, emigrated in 1883
* Thomas Johannesson Ronnei/Kalhagen, born in Luster Co., Norway Dec. 28, 1864, emigrated in 1884
As the story goes among relatives in Norway, one of the brothers shall have lost one arm in an accident as a young man, and then one of them is supposed to have resided at Williston, ND in the 1920's, but neither of these facts have been possible to verify!
Any chance one or both of them can be located in America?
I would be very happy for any suggestions and thank you all very much in advance!
Very sincerely yours, |
Lars E. Oyane |
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2021 : 05:54:23
|
Dyre's destination in US was something beginning with Stone _____ (or possibly Stoughton ) in Wisconsin. He came on the Hibernian and landed at Halifax 8 May 1883. He's # 152 on page 14 of the list. |
|
|
loyane
Junior member
Germany
73 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2021 : 12:02:00
|
Dear Jackie and other Listers!
Thank you very much, Jackie, for your latest message! However, I am having problems finding the passenger list in question! What do I do wrong? Is there a handwritten scan of it?
Maybe Thomas can also be located in a passenger list giving his destination: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000000671899
Thanks again!
Very sincerely yours, |
Lars E. Oyane |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2021 : 16:14:08
|
quote:
Thank you very much, Jackie, for your latest message! However, I am having problems finding the passenger list in question! What do I do wrong? Is there a handwritten scan of it?
Dyre 152
https://ibb.co/7pVFkGX |
Edited by - AntonH on 18/04/2021 16:18:43 |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2021 : 16:25:11
|
Here is the best guess as to how the person was transcribed by Ancestry
Lizze J Romier in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935 Name: Lizze J Romier Gender: Male Arrival Age: 20 Birth Year: abt 1863 Departure Port: Liverpool, England Arrival Date: 8 May 1883 Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada and Baltimore, Maryland, USA Vessel: Hibernian
Hibernian |
|
|
loyane
Junior member
Germany
73 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2021 : 16:33:49
|
Dear Anton and other Listers!
Thank you very much for sending me a scan of the passenger record!
There is no doubt at all! Dyre J. Ronnei had the destination of Stoughton, WI, which was a «general starting point» for very many emigrants from Luster Co., Norway at that time!
And I got a good laugh at the transcription presented by ancestry... You have to be locally familiar with the names in order to interpret them more-or-less correctly! I would actually be very interested in helping out with such transcriptions if I had a chance to...
Thanks again for your great assistance!
But how about Thomas and his 1884 emigration?
Very sincerely yours, |
Lars E. Oyane |
Edited by - loyane on 22/04/2021 12:55:50 |
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 18/04/2021 : 17:26:46
|
quote: Originally posted by loyane
Dear Jackie and other Listers!
Thank you very much, Jackie, for your latest message! However, I am having problems finding the passenger list in question! What do I do wrong? Is there a handwritten scan of it?
Maybe Thomas can also be located in a passenger list giving his destination: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000000671899
Thanks again!
Very sincerely yours,
I have looked since there were only about 25 others leaving the same day as Thomas but no luck so far in checking their names as well as his. It would be valuable since it seems likely he would have "gone to" a near relative, meaning Dyre. |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 21/04/2021 : 02:22:43
|
quote: But how about Thomas and his 1884 emigration?
Thomas Johansson in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935 Name: Thomas Johansson Gender: Male Arrival Age: 19 Birth Year: abt 1865 Departure Port: Liverpool, England Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1884 Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada Vessel: Oregon
Passenger following Thomas is Britha Gjertsdatr Foshougen age 35 and her two children. Listed as wife but obviously not the wife of Thomas.
https://ibb.co/MPxxpzm
Oregon
|
Edited by - AntonH on 21/04/2021 02:24:47 |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 21/04/2021 : 02:26:11
|
Britha Gjertsdatr Foshougen
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/view/8/pe00000000671900
Brita Gesdatter in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935 Name: Brita Gesdatter Gender: Female Arrival Age: 35 Birth Year: abt 1849 Departure Port: Liverpool, England Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1884 Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada Vessel: Oregon |
Edited by - AntonH on 21/04/2021 02:28:09 |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 21/04/2021 : 09:54:21
|
quote: Originally posted by lyndal40
quote: But how about Thomas and his 1884 emigration?
Thomas Johansson in the Canada, Arriving Passengers Lists, 1865-1935 Name: Thomas Johansson Gender: Male Arrival Age: 19 Birth Year: abt 1865 Departure Port: Liverpool, England Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1884 Arrival Port: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada Vessel: Oregon
Passenger following Thomas is Britha Gjertsdatr Foshougen age 35 and her two children. Listed as wife but obviously not the wife of Thomas.
https://ibb.co/MPxxpzm
Oregon
The record also says Thomas is contracted to go to Portland (which I assume means Portland, Maine): https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2Q92-ZN2 |
|
|
loyane
Junior member
Germany
73 Posts |
Posted - 21/04/2021 : 12:46:29
|
Dear Jackie, Anton and other Listers!
Thank you very much for several interesting messages in regard to Thomas Johnson!
That «candidate» from Mille Lacs Co., MN looks very exciting. His birthmonth is not quite a «match», but we all know that birth information may often be off...
I have been looking for the family in the 1895 state census for MN, but they are NOT in Mille Lacs Co., MN at that time, and I notice that at least one of the children was born in WI (Ida Sep. 1896), and ancestry suggests this be Ida Emelia born in Jackson Co., WI Sep. 3, 1896 to Tollef and Ellen Johnson: https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/60722/images/41742_314966-00385?treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&usePUBJs=true&_ga=2.259746058.1621079734.1618435785-390650824.1612707015&pId=783720
And in Martin Co., MN I find this marriage: MARTIN Book C, Page 394 05/31/1894 JOHNSON, TOLLEF KNUDSEN, ELEN
So I fear this is probably not the Thomas that we are looking for...
HOWEVER, according to the passenger record from 1884 showing Thomas Johannessen as an emigrant, you, Jackie, say he intended to go to Portland! I cannot see that note anywhere in the passenger record, and I wonder: Could it be Portland, ND (where MANY Sognings lived at that time) or even Portland, OR?
The 1885 territorial census for ND shows several Thomas Johnsons who may «match»; in particular my eye catches the one in Steele Co., ND just west of Portland a little ways...: https://www.ancestry.com/search/collections/1078/?name=thomas_Johnson&birth=1864_norway_5173&birth_x=2-0-0_1-0&count=50&name_x=ps_ps&residence=1885&residence_x=0-0-0
I would also like to make another note: I have seen several Dyres from Luster Co., Norway who become David in America. Could «our» Dyre have become David Johnson?
How about this guy in Milwaukee, WI: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XRW5-ZQ7
Name David Johnson Sex Male Age 52 Death or Burial Date Nov 1909 Death or Burial Place Milwaukee, Wisconsin, United States Death or Burial Place (Original) Milw. Med. College Death Date 26 Nov 1909 Death Place Wauwatosa, Milwaukee, Wisconsin Birth Date 5 Jun 1857 Birthplace Norway Marital Status Single Occupation Night Watch Race White
NB: Birth date is just one day off!
Here is the same guy in 1900, single and emigrated 1882: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6619-NNQ?i=11&cc=1325221&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AMMVV-BMH
There was another David Johnson in Milwaukee, WI at the same time, married to a Sarah, but he (born Dec. 1859) apparenty moved to Aurora, IL
Maybe an obituary or a death notice can be found for David Johnson who died in 1909?
Thanks again for your great efforts trying to locate these brothers!
Very sincerely yours, |
Lars E. Oyane |
Edited by - loyane on 22/04/2021 12:56:22 |
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 21/04/2021 : 15:27:50
|
quote: Originally posted by loyane
Dear Jackie, lundal40 and other Listers!
Thank you very much for several interesting messages in regard to Thomas Johnson!
That «candidate» from Mille Lacs Co., MN looks very exciting. His birthmonth is not quite a «match», but we all know that birth information may often be off...
I have been looking for the family in the 1895 state census for MN, but they are NOT in Mille Lacs Co., MN at that time, and I notice that at least one of the children was born in WI (Ida Sep. 1896), and ancestry suggests this be Ida Emelia born in Jackson Co., WI Sep. 3, 1896 to Tollef and Ellen Johnson: https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/60722/images/41742_314966-00385?treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&usePUBJs=true&_ga=2.259746058.1621079734.1618435785-390650824.1612707015&pId=783720
And in Martin Co., MN I find this marriage: MARTIN Book C, Page 394 05/31/1894 JOHNSON, TOLLEF KNUDSEN, ELEN
So I fear this is probably not the Thomas that we are looking for...
HOWEVER, according to the passenger record from 1884 showing Thomas Johannessen as an emigrant, you, Jackie, say he intended to go to Portland! I cannot see that note anywhere in the passenger record, and I wonder: Could it be Portland, ND (where MANY Sognings lived at that time) or even Portland, OR?
The 1885 territorial census for ND shows several Thomas Johnsons who may «match»; in particular my eye catches the one in Steele Co., ND just west of Portland a little ways...: https://www.ancestry.com/search/collections/1078/?name=thomas_Johnson&birth=1864_norway_5173&birth_x=2-0-0_1-0&count=50&name_x=ps_ps&residence=1885&residence_x=0-0-0
I would also like to make another note: I have seen several Dyres from Luster Co., Norway who become David in America. Could «our» Dyre have become David Johnson?
How about this guy in Milwaukee, WI: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XRW5-ZQ7
Name David Johnson Sex Male Age 52 Death or Burial Date Nov 1909 Death or Burial Place Milwaukee, Wisconsin, United States Death or Burial Place (Original) Milw. Med. College Death Date 26 Nov 1909 Death Place Wauwatosa, Milwaukee, Wisconsin Birth Date 5 Jun 1857 Birthplace Norway Marital Status Single Occupation Night Watch Race White
NB: Birth date is just one day off!
Here is the same guy in 1900, single and emigrated 1882: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6619-NNQ?i=11&cc=1325221&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AMMVV-BMH
There was another David Johnson in Milwaukee, WI at the same time, married to a Sarah, but he (born Dec. 1859) apparenty moved to Aurora, IL
Maybe an obituary or a death notice can be found for David Johnson who died in 1909?
Thanks again for your great efforts trying to locate these brothers!
Very sincerely yours,
The far right column is called "Port at which passengers have contracted to land." Everyone on that page has that designation sort of dittoed.
Glad you had some experience with what an anglicized version of Dyre could be, I was drawing a complete blank.
This might be your David in FAG: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/110494268/david-johnson
If he is the same man as you found, probably means he was "on the county" and his body was donated to medical science.
Found no mention of David Johnson in 1909 as in death notice nor obituary in the Milwaukee paper I have access to. |
Edited by - jkmarler on 21/04/2021 17:19:05 |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 22/04/2021 : 03:50:29
|
A little more information on this version of FAG
David Johnson in the Global, Find a Grave Index for Burials at Sea and other Select Burial Locations, 1300s-Current Name: David Johnson Birth Date: 5 Jun 1857 Birth Place: Norway Death Date: 26 Nov 1909 Death Place: Milwaukee, Milwaukee County, Wisconsin, United States of America Has Bio?: N
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/206158172/david-johnson
https://ibb.co/vx4MFwG |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|