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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
 Posted - 09/04/2007 : 20:35:35
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Hi,
I´m impressed, this is the oposite part in norway from Vegårdshei, we are now in Voss municipality in Hordaland county, but to find a John J. Berge.
The Emigration records for the tree brothers Gullik , Anders and John Johannesen Berge from farm Berge, Voss, nr 28-29-30.
These are the same brothers you pointed out on the passenger list 1870 on Maryland and in the 1865 census.
John Johannesen Berge was born june. 14. and bap. July 10. 1853
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=7093&idx_id=7093&uid=ny&idx_side=-209
But still, even it seems very promising, we are not sure if this is "the right" Joannes J. Berge
Need help!
Kåre |
Edited by - Kåarto on 09/04/2007 21:26:38 |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 09/04/2007 : 22:24:10
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No intention to make any confusion and forget Johannes J., but this bautiful record from Hjartdal/Hierdal April 10. 1777, showing the wedding of Torbjørn Torbjørnsen Jasiaae/Hjartsjø and Margitte Halvorsdatter Uvaas desereve to be seen by more.
Right page, couple nr 4 from the top.
Best men was Kitil Haraldsen and Ambosius Olsen.
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=7952&idx_id=7952&uid=ny&idx_side=-57
Tobjørn Torbjørnsens´s birth record (the only Torbjørn I could find between 1738-1745), in the 1801 census his age was 60.
Left page, nr two from the bottom.
1743
11 April Døbt paa Schiar Torsdag i Hierdal K. Torbiørn Loners Søn Torbiørn.
April 11 Christened Maundy Thursday in Hierdal C.Torbiørn Loners Son Torbiørn
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=7951&idx_id=7951&uid=ny&idx_side=-54
Kåre |
Edited by - Kåarto on 09/04/2007 23:44:12 |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2007 : 03:45:11
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Kåre,
You are right about those records. They are beautiful, especially the wedding record. Thank-you for those.
So you do think that it is worth looking into, to see if that John Johanesson Berge, could be the one I'm looking for? The birthdates are a little off I know and that does bother me, but I want to keep looking. I'd like to find something that would say that he emigrated to Wisconsin. I will check with the Canadian records and see if I can find out more about what happened to him, after arriving there.
Thanks again, Wanda |
Lislcat |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2007 : 13:11:38
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Wanda - Don't forget you had information that his father's name was Jens. True - a death certificate is not the best source possible but that seems to be the best you have so far.
You said he may have lied about his age? So you think he was actually younger? older?
I think you should continue that search for the US records that we previously discussed. Especially for the church records where he and Oline may have been married or members of the congregation. A Lutheran minister often made note of where members had been originally baptised and/or confirmed. |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2007 : 18:16:19
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Hi Hopkins,
Thanks! I am going to follow through on that. I've sent a letter to the pastor of the church that keeps the records for the Lutheran churches that were in that area, so hopefully I'll find out something, now that Easter is over. The reason that I'm wondering if Jens wasn't the name, was because it was my grandfather that gave the information for the death certificate and I'm pretty sure he was even off on the year Johannes was born. If it would of been one of the daughter's that gave the name, I would be more likely to trust it. That's not being sexist, I just know how my grandfather was, because my father was the same way. Neither were good with dates and attention to detail wasn't their strong suit.
I am planning on going to the LDS center and Vesterheim Genealogical Center this week, if the weather cooperates, so hopefully I will learn more.
Thanks again.
Take care, Wanda |
Lislcat |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 10/04/2007 : 20:23:54
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Hi, I think both Hopkins and you are right, the solution is likely in US records.
The closest I get in Vegårdshei is John Johnsen b. Mai 1857, parents, John Olsen and Torbør Aasulsdatter Molandseie.
Some records online are getting updated now and then, lets hope Vegårdshei is one of these.
Kåre |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 01:48:42
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A death certificate or registration of the death with the county often recorded who the informant was. You are right to remain dubious about that document. The informant may have meant well - but perhaps was misinformed, or too emotional to recall such things at that time. I have a family death certificate where the information is so wrong it is almost laughable. (Well - I'm sure the lady's son-in-law meant well....)
I had to take a summer vacation to go back to visit the church where my great-grandparents were members in the rural US midwest. No one still living in that tiny town was willing to try to read the old records they luckily still had safely tucked away - those old records were in Norwegian. Don't be surprised if the current pastor and/or congregation can't help you as much as you hope. If that happens - ask for their permission to see the records yourself, practice your skills in reading the Norwegian parish records (the Digitalarkivet scanned records are WONDERFUL for this) and enjoy a trip. On my own summer trip I also took that opportunity to go through every cemetery near that little rural church - and visited the graves of many ancestors. |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 02:44:48
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Hopkins,
I may end up going to the church to go through their records. It is the church that I grew up in, so I'm hoping that since I use to know the church secretary, that she might consider doing the look-up for me. :) I took my trip to the cemeteries in that area over Thanksgiving weekend. I found a lot of family members at the three cemeteries I visited. My family really enjoyed walking through the cemeteries and finding family that we didn't even know were buried there. My daughter keeps asking when our next trip to a cemetery is. Ha, ha.
As you say, I'm sure my grandfather meant well, but I just don't trust the info on Johannes's death certificate as fact. It gave me some valuable information, such as family medical history, which was very important to me. It's just another piece to the puzzle, which "will" come together at some point.
Thanks again, Wanda |
Lislcat |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 19:18:05
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Kåre or anyone else that can help,
I have been reading through all the information that you have found for me on Johannes Berge's in-laws in Hjartdal, but am having trouble decifering something, so if you could please take a look at this record and tell me what it says Ole Johannesen's occupation is, my eyes would be very grateful. I know that his father-in-law was a "lensmann", so am wondering if he worked in an official compacity also. It looks like it says "lovkarl" or something like that and "lov" is law, isn't it?
Ole Johannesen Hjartsjø age 27 and his wife Ragnild Johnsdatter Hjartsjø age 22 and their 3 month old daughter, b. Feb. 25, Ragnild Olsdatter Hjartsjø emigrated Mai 19. 1843, persons nr 11-12-13, right page.
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=7959&idx_id=7959&uid=ny&idx_side=-193
Thanks for your help. Wanda |
Lislcat |
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tlwright65
Senior member
USA
433 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 20:04:53
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| looks like löskarl which in the dictionary is løskarl means free hand, takes any job that comes along |
Tami |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 20:27:18
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Thanks Tami! That sounds right.
What dictionary do you use, because I couldn't find that in mine.
Thanks again, Wanda |
Lislcat |
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tlwright65
Senior member
USA
433 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 20:28:59
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I use the Norwegian-English dictionary that's in the Links at the top right!! It has been so helpful.
The middle one actually that says Norwegian-American!! |
Tami |
Edited by - tlwright65 on 11/04/2007 20:31:38 |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 20:32:55
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You are right Tami, Ole was a løskarl, or løsarbeider which means almost the same.
This dictionary has both løskarl and løsarbeider.
http://home.online.no/~otjoerge/files/word.htm
Just to be sure, according corrections in Hjartdalsoga, band III A, p. 575:
Anne Olsdatter Mæland born 1797 on Hauge-Mæland married 1815 to widower Jon Torbjørnsen Hjartsjø, farmer and lensmann (Sheriff), see Øvre (Upper) Midtbøen in Gvammen and Sud (Southern) Hjartsjø, B III
Kåre |
Edited by - Kåarto on 11/04/2007 23:09:03 |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 11/04/2007 : 20:50:11
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Thank you both!
It wasn't in my Norwegian-English dictionary. The one I have is good with modern Norwegian words, but not the old ones.
Thanks, Wanda |
Lislcat |
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Lislcat
Advanced member
USA
690 Posts |
Posted - 28/06/2007 : 15:21:23
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Hi All,
Will my frustration in trying to find more information on Johannes J. Berge ever end?
Here's an update.
I have been looking through the ALC microfilm for the church he attended in Rosholt, Wisconsin. Most of the early records are in Norwegian and are not as easy to read as some of the Norwegian parish records that I've seen.
I found that he was very involved with the church, as he was listed quite often in the church minutes. I did not find any info on him joining the church or a funeral record, which would of listed his place of birth, if it had been there. For some reason, they only had two people listed as dying in 1933 from that church and that seems low to me.
On a brighter note, I did find the funeral record for his wife, Oline Johnson (Johannesen/Olsen) Berge in 1916. All I had to go on before, was her tombstone, since I couldn't find an obit for her, like I had for Johannes.
I have requested a search for a copy of his Declaration of Intent to apply for Naturalization and possibly Naturization papers, if he ever followed through on the process. I am going to check another local paper for an obit for him, to see if maybe more info would of been listed than what was put in his obit from the Stevens Point Journal.
Does anyone have any ideas on other possible avenues I could try? He wasn't the original owner of his farm, so he wouldn't of filled out Homestead papers, correct? Is there anywhere else that he may of had to list where he was born, other than just saying "Norway"?
Any help would be appreciated?
Thanks! Wanda |
Lislcat |
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Johannes Berge
