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LisaW
Starting member
Canada
10 Posts |
 Posted - 03/10/2008 : 00:59:29
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Hello everyone,
My Grandfather was Norwegian, but didn't speak Norwegian. This statement now makes sense to me as Dad recently remembered what Grandfather said he was. He was Sami, from northern coastal Norway. I can't find Grandfather in any Canadian records & I have looked at censuses & immigration. We think that perhaps the surname that we use today is not the same as would of been used in Norway. Is anyone "brave" enough to take a guess at what Kon would be shortened from. It might not even be Kon, it could be Kom as that is what is stated on his WW1 attestation papers from Canada. Thank you for any suggestions.
Lisa |
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Lester Hanson
Advanced member
USA
567 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 02:37:15
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Lisa:
A full name, date of birth, when he died, which Province, and what years did he live in Canada, would be a big head start, for helpers!
Les
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LisaW
Starting member
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 06:37:02
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Hi Les, Thanks for your reply. Everything I know about Grandfather is more than a little vague & i feel uncomfortable posting because I don't know how accurate it is, but I'll give you what I have.
According to WW1 attestation papers: John Kom born May 4 1894 Russia, his next of kin is his sister Annie Kom. Most of his attestation papers were typed, but there are written words that I can't decipher, such as where Annie lives, written by someone other than Grandfather. It has been suggested that Grandpa was being "politically correct" when saying he was born in Russia at this time period. Grandpa had no use for Russia/Russians. According to his marriage registration from Scotland his parents names are Joseph Kon & Annie Pederson, both deceased as of 1917. He was a boy when he came to Canada, we don't know what year. We know he lived in Montreal Quebec as a child. We also know there was a fire & most of his family was killed in it, we aren't sure where the fire was. A brother saved him. We think that he had a brother named Joseph & one named either Frederick or Franklin. Grandpa & one of his brothers worked for CPR building railroad in British Columbia. According to Grandpa his brother was murdered & is likely under the tracks. There would be no record of this. This seems to of left Grandpa orphaned at a young age. Grandpa has lived in Quebec, Ontario, Saskatchewan, Alberta, & British Columbia, maybe more provinces for all we know. He roamed alot. He died Oct 18 1975 in Vancouver British Columbia. There will be no other information on his death register & I don't think there was much of an obituary, if one at all.
To recap information: John Kon or Kom born May 4 1894 Russia, died Oct 18 1975 British Columbia Canada. Parents: Joseph Kon & Annie Pederson. Siblings: Annie, Joseph, Frederick or Franklin
Now that I've probably confused you I'll thank you again & you probably see why I don't like to post about him.
Cordially, Lisa |
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Lester Hanson
Advanced member
USA
567 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 16:21:56
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Lisa,
I found a Person of Interest, named John Kom in South Dakota.
His WWI Draft Registration Card dated Sept. 12 , 1918, gives his age at 19. Date of birth 25 Dec. 1894 in Russia.
Occupation: Section Hand ?M & ST. P. Ry.
Address: Lemmon, Perkins, S.D.
Mother: Mrs. Katie Kom, Lemmon, Perkins, S.D.
The 1910 S.D. census has the following:
1910 United States Federal Census
Name: Anthon Kom
Age in 1910: 43
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Birthplace: Russia
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: Russia
Mother's Birth Place: Russia
Spouse's Name: Katie
Home in 1910: Meadow, Perkins, South Dakota
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male
Year of Immigration: 1898
Household Members: Name Age
Anthon Kom 43
Katie Kom 37
John Kom 11
Andrew Kom 10
Anthon Kom 7
Amie Kom 6
Magadine Kom 5
Charles Kom 1 2/12
There is another Kom family listed on the same page. The Head of Household is Stanislaus Kom, wife Laura, and 5 children. His mother is Elizabeth Kom,
The SSI death index has this info:
Social Security Death Index
Name: John Kom
SSN: 501-22-3101
Last Residence: 57638 Lemmon, Perkins, South Dakota, United States of America
Born: 25 Aug 1899
Died: Feb 1989
State (Year) SSN issued: North Dakota (Before 1951 )
Could these people be related to you?
Les
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LisaW
Starting member
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 17:02:24
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Hi Les,
Wow, didn't think I'd get another reply, I usually don't with the vagueness of my postings. I have no idea if they would be related to us or not. Its definitely worth looking into. Grandpa didn't talk much about his childhood, he had a hard childhood & preferred not to talk about it. Dad says they never met any Aunts or Uncles from his Dad's side, they just assumed they were all dead or still in the "old country". Thanks Les I'll follow up on these people.
Cordially, Lisa |
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Lester Hanson
Advanced member
USA
567 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 17:34:57
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Lisa,
Sounds like you have access to Ancestry.com. Check the Family Tree section for Johann 'John' Kom. It could speed up your process of checking.
Les |
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Kċarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 17:35:19
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If Kon or Kom is a shortening or a real Sami lastname I cant help you with, sorry.
They were likly coming from Finnmark county.
Since they were from the coastal area they were likely "Sjĝsamer" Sea Sami, and had most of their income from fishing.
All I can give you is some information and many links for help and a better understanding of the Sami people
Kċre |
Edited by - Kċarto on 03/10/2008 20:35:48 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 17:36:48
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Hi Lisa,
At the archivia.net website are a couple database in addition to the WWI soldiers you have already seen. They have a Russian immigrants database which has 7 or 8 Kon, a few of the listings give provinces for the people. The site suggest Cohen as an alternate spelling of the name Kon. Most appear to be Jewish which brings me to another piece of information on your man. On the attest he is listed as Roman Catholic. What sort of Catholic churches are in Buchanan, Saskatchewan, perhaps he was attending?
It seems to me that you need an assist in Russian history or Russian geography which might be able to sort out the ins & outs of the language and tell you about the provinces historically. Is there a university or college near you? Try their history or language departments.
Just checked in the Ellis island database and there are several Kon listings including the Stanislaus Kon mentioned by Les Hanson. I'm pasting in the one with a most interesting point of origin in Russia:
Jan Kon Czarkowa, Russia 1907 30
Of course the age isn't right to be your guy, but interesting place name.
I see that you have been posting queries a long time. Good Luck.
Jackie M. |
Edited by - jkmarler on 03/10/2008 19:05:20 |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 21:42:35
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Hi,
there are also a couple Joseph (33) & Annie (27) Kon in the census-1900 for Plymouth, Luzerne, Pennsylvania. Household Members:
Mary Kon 4
Martin Kon 2
Francis Kon 3 months
Mary Koshoroski 23
Jos. Con & Anna Botorma are from Poland and married 25 NOV 1893 in Luzerne, Pennsylvania.
Probably not related, but I put them up here anyway...
What are the sources for John Kom being from Norway?
Have you located John in any US or Canadian census? His parents or siblings?
Joseph Kon does not sound Norwegian, but Annie Pederson does... 
Jan Peter |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2008 : 22:17:45
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I see from another post you have that his WW1 attestation papers in Canada 1916 says that his sister Annie lives in Billa (Prov) Czorthiev.
Could it be Bila Tserkva in Ukraine? Just south of the capital Kiev.
In Russian: Belaya Tserkov.
Jan Peter
Btw; being 6 ft tall, I doubt strongly that he was of Sami heritage..., Sami people are like 4 ft tall...  |
Edited by - jwiborg on 03/10/2008 22:44:43 |
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LisaW
Starting member
Canada
10 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2008 : 03:59:41
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A very big & grateful thank you to all of you for your interest & help. It looks like I've done a big circle & will start looking at the Ukraine, Poland & Galacia again. Maybe Joseph Kon was Russian & Annie Pederson was Sami. My Dad & uncles warned me that their Dad had "covered his tracks" well. Then again, they told me I would never find anything out about him & I found out what his parents names were. Maybe I should just be content with that....but I don't want to be. I'll be sure to follow up on all the Kon families in the USA that you've found & I'll check out anything I can find out about Bila Tserkva. Thanks again for following all my pathetic posts about Grampa.
Cordially, Lisa
Btw; I'm like 4 ft tall :)
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2008 : 11:36:33
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Regarding Les' findings above; here is the 1920-census for Lemmon, Perkins, South Dakota (lastname is transcribed as K o r n):
Katie Korn, b 1880, Russia
John Korn, b 1899, Russia (It's easy to mix 4 and 9, so the original record could read 1894)
Tony Korn, b 1901, South Dakota
Annie Korn, b 1903, South Dakota
Lena Korn, b 1905, South Dakota
Charles Korn, b 1909, South Dakota
Barbara Korn, b 1911, South Dakota
Peter Korn, b 1915, South Dakota
Anthon Kom, b 1867 in Russia has either moved out of the household, or is dead.
You should try the Ukraine Genealogy Forum to see if you can get a match on Billa Czorthiev = Bila Tserkva. I have also seen it spelled Biala Tserkiev, and in russian it is spelled Belaya Tserkov.
Maybe there would be birthrecords from 1894 available?
One thing is strange though. I agree that Annie Pederson could be of Norwegian (or Swedish/Danish) heritage, but how did she meet Joseph Kon?
It was very uncommon for Norwegians to travel to Ukraine in 1894.
We had one explorer though, Fridjof Nansen, who in the 1920's had general charge of the Red Cross famine relief in the Volga and South Ukraine regions of the former USSR, and in which he received the Nobel Peace Prize.
But to travel from Scandinavia to Russia/Ukraine as a young, single girl in the 1890's...? Very doubtful, to say the least. Could he be born somewhere else?
Jan Peter |
Edited by - jwiborg on 04/10/2008 15:23:59 |
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Lester Hanson
Advanced member
USA
567 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2008 : 15:32:22
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Lisa,
The marriage registration papers from Scotland, was that for John's parents?
Les |
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Kċarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2008 : 15:38:48
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From between 1850 to shortly after the revolution in 1917 it was a Norwegian emigration to Russia from Finnmark county.
In 1991 Laila and Thor Thorsen wrote "Russland via Vardĝ" espesially from the Norwegian settlements on the coastal area of Murmansk published on Skutvik publishing house, see #9 including two links to Russian genealogy.
Kċre
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Edited by - Kċarto on 04/10/2008 15:43:27 |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2008 : 15:58:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Kċarto
From between 1850 to shortly after the revolution in 1917 it was a Norwegian emigration to Russia from Finnmark county.
In 1991 Laila and Thor Thorsen wrote "Russland via Vardĝ" espesially from the Norwegian settlements on the coastal area of Murmansk published on Skutvik publishing house, see #9 including two links to Russian genealogy.
Kċre
Murmansk in Russia is "next door" and a part of the Arctic areas of the Scandinavian countries and the Kola Peninsula. The Sami people migrated through this region a lot. But it is a totally different story to travel from there down to Ukraine.
Jan Peter
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2008 : 16:08:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Lester Hanson
Lisa,
The marriage registration papers from Scotland, was that for John's parents?
Les
The marriage registration from Scotland must be for John Kom born May 4 1894. I guess that is where it says his parents names are Joseph Kon & Annie Pederson, and that they're both deceased (as of 1917).
I would guess he married in 1917 then.
Jan Peter |
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At a loss need suggestions please
