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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
 Posted - 28/07/2014 : 19:35:49
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Tysvær was establ. as an independant municipality 1848 when it was a subpaish under Skjold.
Kåre |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 28/07/2014 : 22:11:46
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I wonder if we have looed at this person earlier. Has Hans, Jakob, Tonnesen and Kristine in there.
Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927 about Hans Jakob Tonnesen
Name: Hans Jakob Tonnesen
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 21 aug 1831
Baptism Place: , Sokndal, Rogaland, Norway
Father: Tonnes Eilertsen
Mother: Ingeborg Kristine
FHL Film Number: 126310 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 28/07/2014 : 22:19:25
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Or this one, every thing but mother named Kristine
Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927 about Hans Jörgen Tönnesen
Name: Hans Jörgen Tönnesen
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 28 sep 1829
Baptism Date: 18 okt 1829 (18 Oct 1829)
Baptism Place: Onsøy, Østfold, Norway
Father: Tönne Jensen
Mother: Maren Mathea Olsdatter
FHL Film Number: 125959
Reference ID: bk 5, p 278 |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2014 : 08:41:32
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Thank you so much to everyone for all of the work you have been doing. I haven't had much time to look at the posts recently, but WOW - so many possibilities. Firstly, the Hans Jergen Tonsen who was naturalised in Australia does not seem to be the same person and was noted as being of German birth in the records - However there are many records of "German Sailors" born in "Christiansand", which I believe is a Norwegian county or parish ??
The ONLY official record in Australia so far that I can verify as being the correct "Hans Tonsen", is the information noted on his death certificate in 1906 - that information having been provided by his Australian common law wife.
I am still waiting on copies of more birth and death certificates from Births Deaths & Marriages in NSW for children of Hans Tonsen to try and ascertain more information. If Hans was born about 1852, and left to come to Australia as a sailor, I am assuming he would have been at least 15 or 16 years of age at the time (the death certificate notes his age at Marriage in Newcastle NSW as 17 !! - but I cannot find any official marriage certificate record for him and Elizabeth - as previously stated, she was formally married in 1869 to another person and it would have been almost impossible for her to have obtained a legal divorce until at least 1892 in NSW despite the fact her 1st husband was sent to an asylum for trying to murder her in 1872) -
First child born to Hans & Elizabeth Tonsen was Josephine Hans in 1876, then Neils Hans Joseph in 1878, then Thomas Martin, then Elizabeth Ann, then Christina or Christian - spelled both ways in the same birth record - then Joseph, the Sarah Jane H, then Annie E J, then Elsie Isabella, and last Albert R Tonsen who was born and died in 1896
PS - Elizabeth - Hans' common law Wife had two children to her first husband, Samuel Naylor - William (her father's name was William) in 1870 and John Samuel Naylor in 1872 - her first child with Hans was not born until 1876
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Edited by - KerrieTonsen on 09/08/2014 09:41:35 |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2014 : 08:54:31
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No idea if this could be Hans Tonsen's parents ??
Name: Iver Johannessen
Birth Date: 1823
Birthplace:
Age: 26
Spouse's Name: Caroline Josephine Ammundsdatter
Spouse's Birth Date: 1826
Spouse's Birthplace:
Spouse's Age: 23
Event Date: 28 Oct 1849
Event Place: Oslo, Oslo, Norway
Father's Name: Johannes Tonsen
Mother's Name:
Spouse's Father's Name: Amund Amundsen
Spouse's Mother's Name:
Race:
Marital Status:
Previous Wife's Name:
Spouse's Race:
Spouse's Marital Status:
Spouse's Previous Husband's Name:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: M42824-2
System Origin: Norway-EASy
GS Film number: 255733
Reference ID:
Citing this Record:
"Norway, Marriages, 1660-1926," index, <i>FamilySearch</i> (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/N7YH-2DD : accessed 08 Aug 2014), Johannes Tonsen in entry for Iver Johannessen and Caroline Josephine Ammundsdatter, 28 Oct 1849; citing Oslo, Oslo, Norway, reference ; FHL microfilm 255733. |
KAT |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2014 : 15:44:52
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Re the naturalization record. I'm wondering how many Hans Tonsen there were in Australia? What other details did the record contain--date of arrival in Australia or etc?
Ancestry has a couple of German sailor databases which contain awesome information which may or may not be hooked into the "main" search engine. Perhaps he was Norwegian but arrived on a German ship as an employee? |
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Kåarto
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
5861 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2014 : 23:45:18
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Hans Tonsen and Elizabeth (Elsie) is mentioned here i bit down under Norway records 2 link
Kåre |
Edited by - Kåarto on 08/08/2014 23:50:54 |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2014 : 09:16:41
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| Kåre - the reference to the "Hans Tonsen" in the article you linked mixes two different Hans Tonsens - one who died in 1912 (who was Hans Jurgen Tonsen who was born in Germany in abt 1828, had lived in NSW for 56 years at the date of death in 1912 - so arrived in about 1856, and who died in Sydney and was a labourer - this was the Hans Jurgen Tonsen who was naturalised in NSW) he was a diffferent person to MY Hans Tonsen who died in 1906 and was a master mariner at death - in 1875 when the article was written my Hans Tonsen was a crewman on board the dredge "Sarah" at that time (in Newcastle, NSW) and Henry Thompson was a witness whose address was Mosquito Island (also known as Moscheto or Ash Island) - which was an island in the Hunter River delta near Newcastle. I have verified the date of death of my Hans Tonsen from both the actual death certificate, as well as from memorial notices in Newspapers in Newcastle for him and his daughter Annie, who both died on the 19th November - Hans in 1906 and Annie in 1911, and from memorial notices for Elizabeth Tonsen, his common law wife who died in 1926. I have verified the births of each of the 10 children of Hans & Elizabeth Tonsen with our Department of Births Deaths & Marriages. SOME OF THE CHILDREN WERE REGISTERED WITH THE SURNAME TONSON - but it seems corrections were made, as the same registration number is used for the surname of TONSEN for those children. The surname also had to be corrected from TONSON to TONSEN on Hans' own death certificate |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2014 : 09:36:46
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quote:
Originally posted by lyndal40
Might be him as a crew member and is listed as A B ie Able bodied seaman Column for "Of What Nation" lists Norway.
New South Wales, Australia, Unassisted Immigrant Passenger Lists, 1826-1922
Name: H Tonneson
Estimated birth year: abt 1858
Age: 30
Port of Departure: Levuka & Sewa Fiji
Port of Arrival: Sydney, New South Wales
Voyage Arrival Date: 3 Jun 1888
Vessel Name: Fijian
Origin Location: Norway
Thanks Lyndal but Hans had already fathered quite a few children in NSW by 1888 |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2014 : 09:44:30
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quote:
Originally posted by lyndal40
I wonder if we have looed at this person earlier. Has Hans, Jakob, Tonnesen and Kristine in there.
Norway, Select Baptisms, 1634-1927 about Hans Jakob Tonnesen
Name: Hans Jakob Tonnesen
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 21 aug 1831
Baptism Place: , Sokndal, Rogaland, Norway
Father: Tonnes Eilertsen
Mother: Ingeborg Kristine
FHL Film Number: 126310
Lyndal - from the birth dates, the above are more likely to be Hans' parents and/or grandparents - who, if Hans was born in about 1851 or 1852, would most likely have been in their early twenties at the time |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2014 : 16:28:31
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Your Hans could easily be away from home by the time of the 1865 census. However, here are 3 possibles as long a Stavanger origin is not required nor parents' names of Joseph and Kristine:
Given name equals / fornavn: hans
Last names starts with Tøn /etternavn: tøn, tønes, tønnes, tønnesen, tønness, tønnessen, tønsberg
Birth year 1852 +/- 1 year fodeaar (only found 2 years, none born 1853): 1851, 1852
Hans Tønnesen b Herred (parents are not named Joseph nor Kristine)
http://gda.arkivverket.no/cgi-win/WebCens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=2&filnamn=f61039&gardpostnr=96&personpostnr=540&merk=540#ovre
Hans Gabriel Tønnesn b. Herred (parents are not named Joseph nor Kristine):
http://gda.arkivverket.no/cgi-win/WebCens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=2&filnamn=f61039&gardpostnr=139&personpostnr=746&merk=746#ovre
This Hans Gabriel b. 13 March 1852 #7:
Source information: Vest-Agder county, Herad in Herad, Parish register (official) nr. A 5 (1853-1886), Confirmation records 1866, page 167.
Permanent pagelink: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=4007&idx_id=4007&uid=ny&idx_side=-144
Hans Tønnes., pleieson b. Vanse(foster child parents' names unknown);
http://gda.arkivverket.no/cgi-win/WebCens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=6&filnamn=f61041&gardpostnr=719&personpostnr=3637&merk=3637#ovre
I have looked for the baptismal record of the foster child Hans but have not had any success. Perhaps someone else on forum could look?
Confirmation of possible Hans Gabriel # b. 14 Jan 1850;
Source information: Vest-Agder county, Vanse, Parish register (official) nr. A 11 (1861-1878), Confirmation records 1864, page 247.
Permanent pagelink: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=961&idx_id=961&uid=ny&idx_side=-185
Here is a confirmation of a possible Hans who would be Tønnesen, #14 b 16 July 1851 parents Tønnes Elias Hansen and Edwardine Olsdatter:
Source information: Vest-Agder county, Vanse, Parish register (official) nr. A 11 (1861-1878), Confirmation records 1865, page 252.
Permanent pagelink: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=961&idx_id=961&uid=ny&idx_side=-190
Possible Hans Andreas b. 11 Mar 1852 s/o Andreas Johansen Tor____ and ____ Pedersdatter #22:
Source information: Vest-Agder county, Vanse, Parish register (official) nr. A 11 (1861-1878), Confirmation records 1866, page 254.
Permanent pagelink: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=961&idx_id=961&uid=ny&idx_side=-192 |
Edited by - jkmarler on 09/08/2014 17:26:30 |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 21/10/2014 : 14:49:00
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| I have just received a copy of the birth certificate for Hans Tonsen's eldest son, and it is noted as "Nils Hans JOSEPHSON Tonsen" - so I am wondering if JOSEPHSON might be the surname of the first person to arrive from this family in Australia - perhaps Tones Josephson or Joseph Tonsen (called Hans) |
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KerrieTonsen
Junior member
Australia
38 Posts |
Posted - 21/09/2015 : 06:41:12
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quote:
Originally posted by JaneC
Another tough nut....
Below, a possible?
1865
Living at Akre, Skudenes prestegjeld, Rogaland
Tønnes Tønnesen 48 Skudesnæs Prgj. Husfader g Gbr og Leilænding
Anne Kristine Hansdatter 49 Skudesnæs Prgj. hans Kone g
Hans Tønnesen 23 Skudesnæs Prgj. deres Søn ug Fisker og Dagarbeider
Karen Marie Tønnesdatter 21 Skudesnæs Prgj. deres Datter ug hjælper Forældrene med Gaardsbruget
Tønnes Tønnesen 16 Skudesnæs Prgj. deres Søn ug hjælper Forældrene med Gaardsbruget
Inger Karine Tønnesdatter 13 Skudesnæs Prgj. deres Datter ug
Christiane Tonnesdatter 10 Skudesnæs Prgj. deres Datter ug
Anna Tønnesdatter 6 Skudesnæs Prgj. deres Datter ug
Jakob Tønnesen 3 Skudesnæs Prgj.
As mentioned first-born children to Hans = Josephine Hans Tonsen and Neils Hans Joseph Tonsen, so admittedly the family seemed pretty serious about Joseph/Josef or the like.
Stavanger seems pretty iffy as a birth place. As I've noticed by reading this forum (and elsewhere), often times immigrants named the big port city from which they departed as a point of origin. Perhaps he/she had lived there a little while before departure. The question "where are you from?" doesn't always trigger the actual birth parish, especially when that's a small place not known in the adopted community (in this case, in Australia).
Hans's age is calculated from his death record (only source, is that right?).
From Jan Peter, in a 2005 post: "Tannes, Tennes, Tonne, Tonnes, Tynnes, Tønne, Tønnen, Tønner, Tønnes, Tønni, Tønnis could all be different variations of the same name."
ANY CHANCE YOU CAN TRANSLATE the Norwegian words to English for me - example Husfader (I am presuming means either House Father or Head of House ??) |
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HANS TONSEN
