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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
 Posted - 29/10/2015 : 17:48:53
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Here's a summary of Elie's trip that the forum found:
Register to depart Trondheim 26 April 1893 on the ship Tasso of the Allan line. Ultimate destination Quebec. Ticket paid in America.
Arrive Hull, England, travel to Liverpool.
Depart Liverpool 04 May 1893 on the ship Parisian.
Arrive Quebec 13 May 1893. Parisian incoming passenger manifest gives her destination as Sioux City. |
Edited by - JaneC on 29/10/2015 22:17:15 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 19:11:01
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Ella's brother John Eriksen Asbøl (listed as Johan E) seems to have emigrated 1889, destination Sioux City, Iowa:
Link
So it's reasonable to guess he might be the person who paid Ella's passage. |
Edited by - JaneC on 30/10/2015 22:16:34 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 21:15:14
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Probably your Ella in the 1895 Iowa Censu. It is only indexed so no original to look at. Obviously before her marriage.
Ella Erickson
in the Iowa, State Census, 1895
Name: Ella Erickson
Age: 21
Race: White
Birthplace: Norway
Residence: Sioux City;Sioux City;Third Ward, Woodbury |
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NBos
Starting member
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 21:16:26
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Hi JaneC,
Ella says she came over in 1886 and that is confusing me with the 1893 year you posted.
I do know she married by 1898 and died in 1901. She was born in Sept 1873.
It looks like her father had died in Norway died her mom die there too??
I was only confused with the name because of the date of immigration. I thought it was someone else because of the 1893 date.
So much information now to go through :)
I appreciate every ones help on this so much! I never thought I would be able to get past this brick wall and find her family.
I so wanted to be able to connect her with her family. Here I had this one poor ancestor and no other family for her, but now she has a whole family and more!
Thanks !!
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NBos
Starting member
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 21:24:39
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JaneC,
Sorry I didn't see the post you asked me about siblings. I was brought to the 2nd page and just now went back to the 1st page.
I had been looking for Ella's family for about 10 years or so and I did find the possible parents for her with those 2 siblings listed.
So, the DNA match prompted me to do some more intense digging.
The names have always tripped me up though.
I only had a John and Karen listed in my family files as possible siblings and possible parents names. But, could never prove them, so like I said the DNA match helped.
I also only know some generic Norwegian genealogy words so I have had a hard time with the language as well. But, I have started trying to learn Norwegian to better my research and get more in touch with my family heritage.
Thanks for all you have found! |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 21:33:59
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Agreed that the 1900 census is pesky, saying she immigrated 1886. If it is of any comfort, I looked, and it says her husband immigrated 1889, which is also off. Thank goodness you have other clues that point to the right Ella/ Elie. The paper trail is clear. Your DNA match cinches the deal. We can't know why the 1900 census has immigration year wrong, but this happens a lot in census records.
Not meaning to speak for jkmarler, but I think she posted all those Elies who emigrated to demonstrate that further searching was done on your behalf, for a different emigration record for Elie. Your Elie jumps right out of the line up. The 1893 Elie is traveling with the first cousin of "your" Elie; she is coming from Orkdal and she is going to Sioux City She is the right age; she has the right farm name.Realize, not that many people are living on that farm in that parish, and the forum is used to weeding out "doubles" - two people who are kind of alike. There are no certainties in genealogy outside of DNA, so researchers will just about never say THIS IS HER for sure. It is left to the descendant to accept the findings, or not, which is a tough decision when you're a little unfamiliar with genealogical records in Norway. But I hated to have you miss out on feeling comfortable with Elie Eriksdatter, when you have every reason to accept her.
If the forum had any doubts, they'd say so.
Would be interesting to find brother John in the US. Ella's sister Karen maybe emigrated too. I can't look but maybe someone can, to find further news of Ella's mother Dorthea. |
Edited by - JaneC on 29/10/2015 21:50:34 |
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NBos
Starting member
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 21:44:03
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Sorry I didn't give the 1900 census information here is what I have on that
1900 Sioux City, Woodbury County, Iowa
page 8A
ward 5
Grand Street
1018 ? 96 160
Ole (Olal) Waldum Nov 1872 27 M 2yrs Norway (Part Norway) 1889(No NA?) 11 yrs in US Blacksmith
Ella Sept 1873 26 1child 1 alive Norway (Part Norway) 1886 14 yrs US washwoman
John Sept 1899 5/12 Iowa (Parents Norway)
The Waldum/Valdum family came over on the ship "Hero" they left May 16, 1888. The tickets were paid for by the two oldest sons who had come over to America first and worked here to send money back home to bring the family over. Great Great Grandpa Ole became a Naturalized Citizen.
I would love to find those papers on him, but I don't know where he was naturalized? Maybe Iowa.
My grandmother passed away recently and she had dementia so there was no way of being able to ask her any questions really on the family lately. She did correspond with me about 10 years ago about what she knew and then I did my research from there on what she gave me.
This is what I had in my family tree files for Ella
Parents
Erik (Erich) Jørgensen/Erik Jørgensen Logerende? b. Bet. 1832 - 1833 d. Aft. 1875
Dorthea Olsdatter ?/ Dorthea Olson b.Bet. August 04, 1840 - November 24, 1841
Children
John ? Erichsen Asbøll b. September 23, 1867
Karen ? (Eriksdatter?) Asbøll b. 1870
Ella E. (Eriksdatter?) Asbøll b. September 29, 1873
You can see I didn't have much information (Before all I had was Ella's name)
On her marriage cert it says parents were Erik Jorgensen and Dorthea Olsn
That's why I was confused where she had Asboll listed for her and both parents to me had different names. But it makes more sense now that it would be Erik Jorgensen Asboll
But, why is the brother of Erik with the name Barboe?
Was Erik born in Asboll and his brother born in Barboe??
Sorry for some of my questions I know they probably are very naive, but I really get confused with the way the farm names are added to the family.
Thanks again in advance for every ones help!
If you would like me to post any other information about the family let me know and I will add it.
Have a great day!! |
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NBos
Starting member
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 29/10/2015 : 21:53:16
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The Michael O. Barboe might be Ella's cousin?
There is a son of Ole Jorgensen Barboe named Mikal Olson (1873-1936)
Ole is brother to my Erik
That is where I get confused is why Ole was Barboe and Erik is Asboll
Did both boys be born at the two different farms?? Where is Barbo/Barboe and Asboll located? |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 00:28:09
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The Barboe and Asbøll names are farm names which you have while you live on the farm. Your truer last name is the patronymic portion, Erickson or Jorgenson etc because you are always your father's child but you might not always live on the same farm.
Until you get to US because in US you inherit your surname from your father. So whatever your father's surname is becomes yours. Also people adopted farm names as permanent names in US because there were a billion Olson and you might want just that bit of difference that a farm name would give. Part of the mystery in Norwegian - American research is figuring out which name became theirs.
I posted the list of Eli leaving from Orkdal for you to look for a "better" candidate to be your ancestor. |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 01:26:44
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Looking again at Elie's 1893 departure from Trondheim,on the link posted by lyndal40:
ug is short for ugift / unmarried
arb is short for a type of farm worker
k stands for female and m stands for male
Bill bet. I Amerika means ticket paid for by somebody in America
Ole Jorgensen and Erik Jorgensen both lived on Barbo farm in 1865. If we were their neighbors, and if I mentioned Erik Jorgensen to you, you might say, which Erik Jorgensen? We've got five living around here. Then I'd say, the Erik Jorgensen who lives on Barbo farm.
Let's say Erik Jorgensen moves (actually, he did move). I mention him again to you, same guy. You ask, which Erik Jorgensen? I say the Erik Jorgensen living on --- farm (add the new farm name instead of Barbo).
So the farm name isn't permanent. It doesn't tell where you were born. It's added to better identify exactly which person is meant.
Erik moved off Barbo (1875 census). Ole still lived on Barbo (1875 census). This is why you'll see these two brothers called by different farm names. But they are both JORGENSEN. That part does not change.
You can see this address thing worked well in the old days in small communities and farm neighborhoods. Maybe the system died out because it doesn't hold up as people moved out into the wider world, long distance travel and communication render farm addresses ineffective as identifiers.
In modern Norway people have one last name for the whole family, same as we do.
As for women, traditionally they kept their own name after marriage.
A South Dakota gravestone project has photo of marker for Mikal Olson 1874-1936. Sounds like you know him to be son of Ella's uncle Ole. If that is solid (proven) then that supports the thought that it's him with Ella, immigrating in 1893. |
Edited by - JaneC on 30/10/2015 03:07:22 |
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NBos
Starting member
USA
11 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 15:35:23
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Jane, I am not 100% sure of Mikal, but in someone elses family tree a Mikal fitting these years is listed as a son for those parents.
I have my work cut out for me now! ;)
I will be doing a lot of research this weekend!!
Thank you again every one for your help!
Have a great weekend |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 21:52:56
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And thanks to lyndal40 and jkmarler. I more or less just digested what they found.
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Edited by - JaneC on 30/10/2015 21:53:09 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 21:58:38
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| And digested it quite well, I must say |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 22:04:51
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Delicious findings!
Here's the BIRTH of YOUR Mikael Olson, NBos:
Mikael Olson
Born 24 April 1874
Svorkmo in Orkdal, Sør-Trøndelag, Norway
Parents: Ole Jørgensen Barbo and Ane Mikkelsdatter
SOURCE: Sør-Trøndelag fylke, Svorkmo i Orkdal, Klokkerbok nr. 671C02 (1873-1892), Fødte og døpte 1874, side 10.
#16
The above birth record is just a few pages beyond the birth of Eli Eriksdatter (your Ella).
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Now see Mikal Olson 1873-1936, below. He's a different guy.
World War I Draft Registration
Canton, Lincoln, South Dakota
Mikal Olson
Born 02 February 1873
Carpenter
Wife: Albertine Olson
The above Mikal might be this guy, I don't know:
Norway Baptisms (Ancestry.com)
Oluf Rikard Mikal Olsen
Birth Date: 02 Feb 1874
Baptism Place: Bjornskinn, Nordland, Norway
Father: Hans Olai Matias Olsen
Mother: Anne Gurie Olsdr
Mikal Olson 1873-1936 on Find-a-Grave
in Canton, Lincoln, South Dakota,
with wife Albertine:
Albertine
Mikal
So that's not an exhaustive study of the situation, but likely the "Mikal Olson 1873-1936" on somebody's tree is not the son of Ole Jørgensen Barbo, and they just grabbed Ole's son Mikael because of a coincidence of name and age. |
Edited by - JaneC on 30/10/2015 22:47:05 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 30/10/2015 : 22:21:59
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Aha! Here's your Mikael (Ella's cousin):
World War I Draft Registration
Michael Barbo, age 44
Residence: 504 5th Ave, Seattle
City: Seattle, King, Washington
Born: 24 Apr 1874
Naturalized US Citizen, born in Norway
Carpenter, not employed
Medium height, medium build, blue eyes, light hair
Right Leg Gone
Nearest relative:
Mrs. Beret Barbo, residence 2031 Abudeen? Butte, Mt [=Butte, Montana]
Draft Board: 06
Butte, Montana is in Silver Bow county.
MARRIAGE, same Michael (Ancestry.com)
Name: Michael Or Michal Barbo
Age: 34
Birth Date: 1873
Marriage Date: 2 Nov 1907
Marriage Place: Silver Bow, , Montana
Father: Ole Barbo
Mother: Annie Moe
Spouse: Beret Barbo
FHL Film Number: 1906801
1910 US Census
Butte Ward 7, Silver Bow, Montana
Mike Barbo 38 b abt 1872 Norway, to USA 1900
Beret Barbo 26 [21] b Norway, to USA 1903
Olaf Barbo 1
1930 US Census
Butte, Silver Bow, Montana
Michel Barbo 55 b Norway, to USA 1891, carpenter --?-- (hard to read occupation)
Bertha Barbo 55 wife
Olaf Barbo 21 son
Bertha Barbo 17 daughter
Find-a-Grave Memorial
Michael Barbo
1874-1938
Burial: Mountain View Cemetery, Silver Bow, Montana
link
So that demonstrates that Ella's cousin Mikael did indeed emigrate to the USA - and makes it plausible and indeed likely that he is the Mikael traveling with her in 1893.
BTW in 1900 it's probably your Mike Barbo age 26 living in Township 147, Griggs, North Dakota. The 1900 census says this guy was born in April 1874, which fits your Mike. He's single, a boarder in a large household. |
Edited by - JaneC on 30/10/2015 22:48:32 |
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Looking for help please with brick wall on my GG g
