| Author |
 Topic  |
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
 Posted - 05/01/2019 : 02:01:26
|
quote:
I have difficulties following status of the various finds in this thread,
You are not alone Tore. That is why I keep going back to the original records as you did above. The various family trees I have seen on Ancestry.com are mostly built off one another and rarely provide many original Norwegian records. In fact most of them do not provide any original records at all.
In the end it will be up to Penny to determine what her family tree will look like but perhaps we can give her some oringal records that she can build from . |
Edited by - AntonH on 05/01/2019 02:01:48 |
 |
|
|
ToreL
Advanced member
Norway
842 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 02:40:25
|
| But however the other pieces fit together, the groom in 1874 and the boy born out of (before) wedlock in 1840 were likely the same. |
|
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 02:43:07
|
I've been very confused by this search also. Has Penny actually done the paper research to find her Norwegian ancestry? Or has she relied on published Ancestry tree?
Generally when people only have a month and year birthdate, it means that they have found their ancestor in the 1900 US census. There is an Ole Bergeson born in 1841 Norway living in US:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MMTC-H7V
Name Ole Bergeson
Event Type Census
Event Year 1900
Event Place Arion & Buffalo Townships, Cloud, Kansas, United States
Gender Male
Age 59
Marital Status Married
Race White
Race W
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Years Married 30
Birth Date Jun 1841
Birthplace Norway
Marriage Year (Estimated) 1870
Immigration Year 1867
Father's Birthplace Norway
Mother's Birthplace Norway
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Ole Bergeson Head M 59 Norway
Marie A Bergeson Wife F 58 Sweden
Julia E Bergeson Daughter F 26 Kansas
Levy B Bergeson Son M 24 Kansas
Alice M Bergeson Daughter F 18 Kansas
Emma Cole Daughter F 23 Kansas
Pansy B Cole Granddaughter F 0 Kansas |
|
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 02:48:37
|
There seems to be two families at play here. Farm names vary from record to record so I chose the ones the OP seems to use to separate the two of them.
Berger Halvorsen and his wife Olianna Nilsdatter of Svarthaugen
childen are
Halvor Feb 28, 1839 Opfahl #60
Karen Aug 19, 1842 Svarthaugen #262
Oline Oct 17, 1845 Svarthaugen #236
From the Norwegian Census Records
Nlis 1850
Karoline 1854
Oline 1856
Bernt 1861
Berger Amundsen and his wife Oliana Olsdatter of Rusten
Baptism of Berger Amundsen
Link
Children are :
Oluf June 7, 1838 Rusten #103
Ole April 26, 1840, Ole was born out of wedlock, father is listed as Berger Amundsen Rusten and mother is Oliana Olsdatter Hammeren.
#102
Ann Marie Dec 24, 1842 Rusten #24
Oline June 1, 1845 Hammeren #176
Bernt March 8, 1848 Hammeren #115
My conclusion is that the Ole Bergersen that the OP seeks is the one born to Berger Amundsen Rusten and Olianna Olsdatter Hammeren.
Berger Halvorsen Svarthaugen did not have a son named Ole. |
Edited by - AntonH on 07/01/2019 01:30:27 |
|
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 03:24:38
|
quote:
But however the other pieces fit together, the groom in 1874 and the boy born out of (before) wedlock in 1840 were likely the same.
Tore is correct. As I have also shown above with the children of the two Berger men, only one has an Ole and he is connected to the Hammeren farm through his unwed mother for his baptism record and to the same farm for his marriage in which his birthplace is listed as Hammeren. |
Edited by - AntonH on 05/01/2019 03:25:15 |
|
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 03:30:24
|
Back to Jackie's question about where the OP gets her information. It comes from US records on Ancestry.com and other Ancestry.com Family Trees. This is likely where the birth date originates.
Ole Bergersen
in the U.S., Find A Grave Index, 1600s-Current
Name: Ole Bergersen
Birth Date: 26 Apr 1841
Death Date: 9 Mar 1897
Cemetery: Hegland Cemetery
Burial or Cremation Place: Hawley, Clay County, Minnesota, United States of America
Has Bio?: N
Spouse: Olivia Bergerson
Children: John Albert Bergersen
Henry O Bergerson
Peter Edwin Bergerson
Ole Bergerson
Ben Bergerson
Mary Holmes
Emma Olivia Olson
The day and month match, the birth year is off by one. |
Edited by - AntonH on 05/01/2019 03:32:49 |
|
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 03:55:23
|
This guy going right to Clay county, Minnesota?
51068 1882 482 4 4794a 1 04.05.1882 05.05.1882 Ole Bergers. g Arb m 35 Aasnæs Hawley Blichfeldt Rollo Betalt
51069 1882 482 5 4794b 04.05.1882 05.05.1882 Ovidia Bergers. g k 30 Aasnæs Hawley Blichfeldt Rollo Betalt
51070 1882 482 6 4794c 04.05.1882 05.05.1882 Olia Bergers. Barn k 4,5 Aasnæs Hawley Blichfeldt Rollo Betalt
51071 1882 482 7 4794d 04.05.1882 05.05.1882 Maria Bergers. Barn k 3 Aasnæs Hawley Blichfeldt Rollo Betalt
51072 1882 482 8 4794e 04.05.1882 05.05.1882 Bernhard Bergers. Barn m 1,5 Aasnæs Hawley Blichfeldt Rollo Betalt
Name Ole Bergeson
Event Place Eglon, Clay, Minnesota
Age (Expanded) 44 years
Birth Year (Estimated) 1841
Birthplace Norway
Race White
Gender Male
Volume Clay
Ole Bergeson M 44y Norway
Olivia Bergeson F 32y Norway
Olia Bergeson F 10y Norway
Bertha Marie Bergeson F 8y Norway
Bernard Bergeson M 5y Norway
Olisi Bergeson F 2y Minnesota
Ole Bergeson M 0y 6m Minnesota
Citing this Record
"Minnesota State Census, 1885," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQXH-8WW : 4 August 2017), Ole Bergeson, Eglon, Clay, Minnesota; citing p. 2, volume Clay, State Library and Records Service, St.Paul; FHL microfilm 565,736.
Name Ole Bergesen
Event Place Eglon township, Clay, Minnesota
Age 53y
Birth Year (Estimated) 1842
Birthplace Norway
Race (Original) W
Gender Male
Ole Bergesen M 53y Norway
Olivia Bergesen F 43y Norway
Bernard Bergesen M 16y Norway
Ole O Bergesen M 11y Minn
John Bergesen M 7y Minn
Edwin Bergesen M 5y Minn
Henry Bergesen M 2y Minn
Emma Bergesen F 4m Minn
Citing this Record
"Minnesota State Census, 1895," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQ6Z-41J : 3 April 2016), Ole Bergesen, Eglon township, Clay, Minnesota; citing p. 15, line 28, State Library and Records Service, St.Paul; FHL microfilm 565,767.
Name Olivia Bergerson
Event Type Census
Event Year 1900
Event Place Eglon & Hawley Townships Hawley village, Clay, Minnesota, United States
Gender Female
Age 47
Marital Status Widowed
Race White
Race W
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Number of Living Children 1
Birth Date Jun 1853
Birthplace Norway
Immigration Year 1882
Father's Birthplace Norway
Mother's Birthplace Norway
Mother of how many children 9
Olivia Bergerson Head F 47 Norway
Mary Bergerson Daughter F 23 Norway
Bennie Bergman Son M 22 Norway
Lizzie Bergman Daughter F 19 Minnesota
Ole Bergman Son M 16 Minnesota
John Bergman Son M 13 Minnesota
Edwin Bergman Son M 11 Minnesota
Henery Bergman Son M 7 Minnesota
Emma Bergman Daughter F 5 Minnesota
Citing this Record
"United States Census, 1900," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M9SS-9GH : accessed 5 January 2019), Olivia Bergerson, Eglon & Hawley Townships Hawley village, Clay, Minnesota, United States; citing enumeration district (ED) 303, sheet 2A, family 24, NARA microfilm publication T623 (Washington, D.C.: National Archives and Records Administration, 1972.); FHL microfilm 1,240,760.
|
Edited by - jkmarler on 05/01/2019 04:14:00 |
|
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 04:24:51
|
I have not added this 1865 Census to the list of children of Berger Amundsen and Oleanne Olsdatter since the farm is listed as Lifsgaarden and none of the children that I have posted above are at this farm in 1865. Now they may have left home by this date. Or this may be a separate family altogether.
1865
Berger June 13, 1847 Lifgaard #189
Some further research shows that there is also a second couple named Berger Amundsen and Oliana Olsdatter living at the same time as Berger Amundsen and Oliana Olsdater Rustad. They are Berger Amundsen and Oliana Olsdatter Livgaard. Here is the baptism record for their son Arne, born May 2, 1840, nearly the same time as the son Ole of Berger Amundsen and Olianna Olsdatter Rustad.
#88
As well as a daughter name Karen Andrrine on Jan 4, 1844.
#16
As wel as a Gunnerus Feb 2, 1836
#34
And an Ole burn in 1833 father is Berger Amundsen Livgaard
#32 |
Edited by - AntonH on 07/01/2019 02:45:14 |
|
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 04:38:29
|
You might have to describe what you are seeing the link will not load on my computer.
Never mind, I clicked the link on my phone and the linked worked. I saw the placard with the Removed sign. |
Edited by - AntonH on 05/01/2019 16:18:25 |
|
|
|
jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 17:23:53
|
I followed the link from familysearch to the FAG Ole Bergerson b 1841 d 1897 buried in Clay county, Minnesota and his memorial has been removed. Makes one wonder why? He does not appear with the family in the 1900 census and his wife is listed as widowed, so obviously dead by 1900.
Larger question is how the OP came to be looking at Ole Bergersons in the first place. Traditional research method is to start with yourself and then go to each generation of h your ancestors and relatives back til such time as you have no records or no certainty about the paper record. At least you then know what you have. If OP hasn't done this basic, basic, basic research, how was it determined, with certainty, that she connects to an Ole Bergerson b about 1840 Norway?
The non speaking Norwegian is a bogus reason not to contact the connector in Grue. English is the required 2nd language for all Norwegians within the last, at least, 40 years. They may be somewhat unpracticed having not used from school age but mostly you will find someone with English capability. As was remarked earlier, in a lot of cases, the Norwegians do better with English than a lot of American native English speakers!
If this is based only on a DNA find, without knowing anything about the quality of the DNA testing employed, and the kind of connection recorded there, this research is destined to be error ridden, and unsatisfactory.
While I'm willing to help out most anybody who posts here and put in some time on the quest, this lack of information is unsettling. So if NorwayHeritage is Shark Tank, I'm out!
I wish the OP well, good luck!
|
|
|
|
pennywychopen
Starting member
Canada
14 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 20:25:52
|
| I’m sorry, and thank you everyone for your time, I’m not sure of your find-a-grave result but mine had memorial number 58444748, in which there was a photo. Again thanks everyone! |
|
|
|
ToreL
Advanced member
Norway
842 Posts |
Posted - 05/01/2019 : 21:18:38
|
| The FAG entry with the number you cite works fine for me. It gives the birth date of April 26th 1841, as Anton already reported, and I think we have established well beyond any sensible doubt that the person buried here was none other than the boy born at Hammeren before is parents were married, and then married Olivia in 1874. Tomb stones showing correct birthdates and slightly wrong birth years are a common phenomenon -- children get reminded of the former once every year and reflect less on the latter. |
|
|
|
AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9301 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2019 : 23:04:16
|
Just a heads up Penny. I have added some new children to the list in my post above for Berger Amundsen Rusten and Olianne Olsdatter Hammeren. They had six children including your Ole. I also found that there is another Berger Amundsen and Olianna Olsdatter living in the Hof parish at the same time as your Berger Amundsen Rusten and Olianna Olsdatter Hammeren. They are associated with the farm named Livgaard (or Løvgaard). So you need to make sure in your research to keep that in mind. I have stopped working on Berger Halvorsen Svarthaugen and Olianna Nilsdatter as I do not think they are a part of your family.
|
Edited by - AntonH on 07/01/2019 00:17:37 |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
Researching 2x great-grandfather Ole Bergersen
