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ToreL
Advanced member
Norway
858 Posts |
 Posted - 12/01/2025 : 20:56:29
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| Lom-Kari's Geni-profile, with lots of data for her siblings. The older brother named Lars matches this FAG-record. The younger Lars only has a date of birth on Geni, but it matches this FAG-record, with death in 1912 and burial at the same cemetery as his older brother with the same name. |
Edited by - ToreL on 12/01/2025 21:24:55 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9333 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2025 : 22:20:05
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Here is likely where the fathers name of Thomas Borgen comes from.
Indiana, Death Certificates, 1899-2011
Name Carrie Herbert
Gender Female
Race White
Marital Status Widowed
Age 86
Birth Date 2 Jul 1838
Birth Place Norway
Death Date 21 Jun 1925
Death Place Hammond, Lake, Indiana, USA
Death Registration Date 1925
Father Thomas Borgen
Spouse Hestor Victor Herbert
https://www.ancestry.com/family-tree/person/tree/13940358/person/321489288/facts |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9333 Posts |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9333 Posts |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9333 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2025 : 22:48:24
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Son Teodor Borgon was born in Vernon County Wisconsin in 1878.
Teodor Borgen
in the U.S., Evangelical Lutheran Church in America Church Records, 1781-1969
Name Teodor Borgen
Baptism Age 0
Record Type Baptism
Birth Date 10 Aug 1878
Baptism Date 26 Dec 1878
Baptism Place Vernon, Wisconsin, USA
Father
Lars T Borgen
Mother
Sigrid Olsdr
Church Name Bad Axe Lutheran Church
Church Location Viroqua, Wisconsin
https://www.ancestry.com/search/collections/60722/records/1645401 |
Edited by - AntonH on 12/01/2025 23:00:51 |
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AntonH
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
9333 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2025 : 22:55:26
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Lars T Borgen (the senior Lars I assume) in 1880 Census., A good chance that this is where Lars the younger and Kari were going in 1874 emigration.
Lars T. Borgen
in the 1880 United States Federal Census
Name Lars T. Borgen
[Lawrence T. Borghese]
Age 35
Birth Date Abt 1845
[Jan. 17, 1845]
Birthplace Norway
[Gudbrandsdalen, Norway]
Home in 1880 Sterling, Vernon, Wisconsin, USA
Dwelling Number 12
Race White
Gender Male
Relation to Head of House Self (Head)
Marital Status Married
Spouse's Name Sigrid Borgen
Father's Birthplace Norway
Mother's Birthplace Norway
Occupation Farmer
Neighbors View others on page
Household Members (Name) Age Relationship
Lars T. Borgen 35 Self (Head)
Sigrid Borgen
30
Wife
Ida Borgen
3
Daughter
Theodor Borgen
1
Son
1880 |
Edited by - AntonH on 12/01/2025 23:00:07 |
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KimShanahan
Starting member
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 00:20:20
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Torel, thank you. Yes, I have been toying with the idea that this could be her in the record traveling with her brother and realize that her name may originally be Karoline/Kari/Karen.
quote:
Originally posted by ToreL
A reflection on first names: In the original post Caroline is added in parenteses after the name Carrie; is this supported by sources? I am aware that Carrie is usually short for Caroline/Carolyn in English, and this name does exist also in Norway, but Kari/Karen is/was much more common, and I have seen many Norwegian Karis ending up as Carries in America.
The father's name Thomas could also be something else. Meeting people in California in the eighties I sometimes kept things simple and called myself Tom rather Tore, which is my actual name.
Which means that this emigration record may be of interest. (Your own Ancestry tree contains a link to an Ancestry version of this record -- that is how I found it.) This Kari is listed right after someone who was probably her brother.
This Kari was born in 1858, but in April rather than July, with a baptism in May: Link. I wouldn't conclude yet that this is your ancestor, unless there is some particular, significant reason why you have the record in your tree.
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KimShanahan
Starting member
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 00:30:43
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Thank you, I will check this lead out. I had been following the migration of Kari and Lars on the Pontecorvo.
Also, the Ancestry Shanahan Family tree was created by me, and I added the Norwegian emigration info as a "touchstone" to work on.
quote]Originally posted by AntonH
Lars T Borgen (the senior Lars I assume) in 1880 Census., A good chance that this is where Lars the younger and Kari were going in 1874 emigration.
Lars T. Borgen
in the 1880 United States Federal Census
Name Lars T. Borgen
[Lawrence T. Borghese]
Age 35
Birth Date Abt 1845
[Jan. 17, 1845]
Birthplace Norway
[Gudbrandsdalen, Norway]
Home in 1880 Sterling, Vernon, Wisconsin, USA
Dwelling Number 12
Race White
Gender Male
Relation to Head of House Self (Head)
Marital Status Married
Spouse's Name Sigrid Borgen
Father's Birthplace Norway
Mother's Birthplace Norway
Occupation Farmer
Neighbors View others on page
Household Members (Name) Age Relationship
Lars T. Borgen 35 Self (Head)
Sigrid Borgen
30
Wife
Ida Borgen
3
Daughter
Theodor Borgen
1
Son
1880
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KimShanahan
Starting member
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 00:39:40
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| To all helpers...I also have found it interesting that the Pontecorvo destination was Quebec. Her husband was Canadian and originated from Quebec. Also the Pontecorvo manifest lists her occupation as "servant"! at 15 years. |
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KimShanahan
Starting member
USA
13 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 13:00:59
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| WOW! Thank you, all. This is a lot to digest. I guess my current focus is to see if there is a trail from Wisconsin to Chicago and validate or invalidate this Kari. |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7816 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 14:37:21
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Kim, where did the birthdate for Carrie that you started this topic with come from? Never mind Tore has answered. Was it a hint from Ancestry as you were building your tree or from some document that you have?
Since you have access to Ancestry, I'd suggest a deeper dive into the ELCA database of pastoral acts. You will be looking for "invisible" threads to connect her to other "Borgen". Perhaps she served as witness to the baptism of one of the other Borgen children, etc. The original records are handwritten (mostly) and some in Norwegian language. You might also find them as Thorson (various spellings) rather than as Borgen.
The Lars T Borgen who died in North Dakota had a tragic end but I didn't find an obituary in which Carrie might have been mentioned as a survivor for him. His death made it as a news event. Still there could be one for any of the siblings in which a sister Kari is listed.
Thor Larsen the father died in 1885. His "mini" estate record says he is survived by 9 children and 4 are in America: #64
Lom lensmannskontor, AV/SAH-PGL-006/H/Ha/Haa/L0001/0001: Dødsfallsprotokoller / Dødsfallsprotokoll, 1885-1894
Brukslenke for sidevisning: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/sk60075310000004
Unfortunately, the survivors are not named and specificially located in his record, as many of the dodsfallsprotokol in Lom do, but it is what it is. |
Edited by - jkmarler on 13/01/2025 17:58:57 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7816 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 14:54:25
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quote:
Originally posted by KimShanahan
To all helpers...I also have found it interesting that the Pontecorvo destination was Quebec. Her husband was Canadian and originated from Quebec. Also the Pontecorvo manifest lists her occupation as "servant"! at 15 years.
Up to about 1850 there were lots of direct from Norway to America trips but after 1850 the British domination of the immigrant shipping became more and more pronounced. United States was not particularly a friendly destination for shippers, required lots of extra supplies for passengers, etc so shippers in Britain curtailed and went to Canada where there were less restrictions. For the immigrants, apart from less water, less food during the trip there was also a benefit as the border between US and Canada was an open one with no health inspections and the like, so perhaps less costly ticket and an easier entry in.
At age 15 in Norway you will likely have been confirmed and in a lot of families at the time when you reached that moment, you were expected to contribute to the family's support. In poorer families that could happen earlier than 15 that you might be "working out." |
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ToreL
Advanced member
Norway
858 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 16:47:37
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quote:
Originally posted by jkmarler
Kim, where did the birthdate for Carrie that you started this topic with come from? Was it a hint from Ancestry as you were building your tree or from some document that you have?
The birthdate is written on the death certificate. |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7816 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 17:34:47
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| Thanks Tore. |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7816 Posts |
Posted - 13/01/2025 : 17:46:56
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According to Lom Book the four in Thor Larson's family who came to America are the two brothers Lars born 1845 & 1847, Kari and the brother Tore born 1851 left Lom in 1869 and then in 1878 left for America.
Probably the brother Thore leaving in 1878:
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/view/8/pe00000000059077
He was in Vefsen in the 1875 census:
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/en/census/person/pf01052415002676
Possibly Thor as Thor Borgen as a member of Spring Brook congregation in Dunn County, Wisconsin giving 25 cts for a fire fund for Alesund Norway in 1904:
https://www.nb.no/items/9164b6fb02427e898530290d69e6f2a7?page=9&searchText=%22tore%20borgen%22
Possibly Tore in FAG:
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/91607592/tom-borgan
In 1910 census Tom Borgan a farmer:
"United States, Census, 1910", , FamilySearch (https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MPVR-P14 : Sat Mar 09 11:17:14 UTC 2024), Entry for Edward Hart and Clara Hart, 1910.
In 1920 census Tom Borgen resident of Dunn County Poor Farm:
"United States, Census, 1920", , FamilySearch (https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MF29-P3Q : Sun Mar 10 09:44:54 UTC 2024), Entry for Tom Borgen, 1920.
1930 census Tom Borgen:
"United States, Census, 1930", , FamilySearch (https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9QC-L12 : Sun Mar 10 18:24:40 UTC 2024), Entry for Tom Borgan, 1930. |
Edited by - jkmarler on 13/01/2025 20:22:04 |
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Lineage for Carrie Borgan/Burgen
