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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
 Posted - 12/02/2008 : 20:39:16
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I would appreciate some more help from the forum members. Members were very helpful in helping me find information on my gggrandfather Halvor Johannesson and his family, including his son Johan Halvorson. Since then I have been trying to find information on Halvor Johannesson's parents. It was determined that Halvor was from Heggebostad. Since he was born in 1804 he wouldn't have been in the 1801 census. But his parents probably would have been. Doing a search on Digitalarkivet I found the following 4 Johannes living in Heggebostad in 1801.
Kvar side nedunder viser maskimalt 10 funne postar. Du kan bla mellom desse sidene ved hjelp av knappane over.
Given name Last name Household pos. Age Marital status Occupation Sex
955 Johannes Torufsen Mand 36 Begge i 1ste ægteskab Huusmand uden jord, dagarbeide M
1338 Johannes Mathisen Deres børn 9 M
1342 Johannes Mathisen Hosbondens fader 80 Enkemand efter 1ste ægteskab Lever af gaarden M
2085 Johannes Larsen Deres børn 28 Ugift Natio. soldat M
Johannes Torufsen and Johannes Larsen are the only two that are the right age to be Halvor's father.
Here is the URL for the page in the census with Johannes Torufsen and his family
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=5&filnamn=f11034&gardpostnr=59&personpostnr=955&merk=955#ovre
Is it reasonable to suppose that Johannes Torufsen is Halvor's father since Johannes Larsen was single in 1801 and would have had to get married, have a least son other than Halvor (to name after the grandfather) and then have Halvor in 1804.
Thanks for any insights or help you can give me.
Richard
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Richard Reise |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 00:23:33
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The record of him when he moved to Rennesøy, Rogaland in 1825 indicates that he is from Øvre Kvinesdal, Hegebostad...
see # 69
The Johannes Larsen you refer to, lives on Reineboe farm in Fiotland sub-parish in Heggebostad parish.
Could this (#8) be his confirmation record?
It's a confirmation record of one Halvor Johannesen in Fjotland in Kvinesdal.
Scan through these these records (Øvre Kvinesdal -Fjotland, Birth and baptism records 1801-1805), and you might find his baptism record, and that Johannes Larsen is his father... 
Jan Peter
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Edited by - jwiborg on 13/02/2008 00:25:12 |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 08:07:08
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Since it in the confirmation record is stated "Omreisende og svigtet af forældre, blev Døpt same dag" - "travelling and abandoned by the parents, was baptized the same day" in the column for parents and "Alder efter Skjøn 19 aar gl" - "Age after judgement 19 years old" in the column for age it is not likely that a baptismal record will be found.
It is stated that he was vaccinated Sept 1 1822 and in that record he is living at the Helle farm and the age was given as 16 years, i.e. born about 1806. There was no Johannes at Helle in Fjotland in 1801. |
Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 13/02/2008 13:31:09 |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 18:23:10
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Thank you both for your help. It looks like it is going to be pretty hard for me to track down Halvor's parents. I guess I need to find some document that requires the name of his parents. Maybe his U.S. naturalization papers. The statement that he was traveling and abandoned by the parents, what do you take that to mean. I know that in the U.S. some people use to kick the children out of the house, when they turned 16, to fend for themselves. They still do it now but the age is more likely to be 18.
Richard |
Richard Reise |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 18:40:25
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My first thought when I read that he was "travelling", was that he was of gypsy family. Their presence in Norway in those days was noticeable, and were well known for travelling around, without any permanent residence.
But that he should have been "abandoned by the parents" does not support that theory.
So I have nothing to back-up that idea...
Jan Peter |
Edited by - jwiborg on 13/02/2008 18:42:01 |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 21:16:27
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Could it be that Halvor was originally from Rennesoy, Rogaland so that when he moved there in 1826 he was just returning “home”? For his wedding to Ingeborg Tjerransdatter on December 28, 1826, two witnesses were Johannes Jacobssen Hoverstein and Hans Christenssen Housken. Could it be that Johannes Jacobsen Hoverstein is Halvor’s father? There are other marriages listed on pages 398 and 399 where Johannes Jacobssen Hoverstein was a witness. One was Anna Tjerrandsdatter Helland’s weeding, Anna is probably Ingeborgs sister. Another one was for Jacob Jacobsen – possibly related to Johannes Jacobssen. Line 148 looks like the groom might be a Johannessen and Johannes Hoverstein is the witness. There are two other interesting lines where Johannes Jacobssen Hoverstein is not a witness. Line 149 the bride is Johanne Johannesdatter. Line 147 has a bride who is Halvorsdatter and one of the witnesses is Hans Christenssen Housken who was a witness at Halvors wedding. Are all the similar names just a coincidence or is Halvor possibly related to these other people?
One last question is Hoverstein a town or farm in Norway?
Thanks
Richard
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Richard Reise |
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jwiborg
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
4961 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 21:57:47
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Hoverstein (Hoversteen) is a farm in Rennesøy, Rogaland.
Jan Peter |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 23:17:59
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Only records will show possible relationships. I would not like to be negative, but the persons chosen to be best men were just as often from the same farms, parents could be living far away from the brides home or work place.
The Houschen farm was the rectory and I assume Hoversteen was one of the bigger farms. Persons there would most likely be knowledgeable and reliable.
Anna Tjerransdatter were a servant on Houschen as was Ole Sørensen when they got married. You find Anna in the 1801 census here
Ingeborg Tjerransdatters baptismal record is on the top of left hand page here
unfortunately the fateher is Tiæran Windhoug under Helland, but we can assume that he is the Kiæran Ariansen from the 1801 census.
You will find Jacob Jacobsens baptismal record in the midle of left hand page here
his father was Jacob Andersen, Sogn, you will find him under the 1801 census here
Relationship with Johannes Jacobssen Hoverstein doubtful.
On line 148 the groom is Iver Johnsen, see the 1801 census here
Johannes Hoversteen was a witness.
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Einar |
Edited by - eibache on 13/02/2008 23:51:33 |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 13/02/2008 : 23:41:23
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All these pieces of information will hopefully lead me to Halvor's parents. The real problem is I need to know where to look. I was trying to locate farm books for Heggebostad to find information on Halvor and it appears that is not where he was born. If I find a likely candidate for his parents or other relatives I can narrow down where to look. The only real clue I have is that his father's name was probably Johannes, so if I examine all Johannes I run across I might find Halvor. Even if I don't find Halvor's father I am enjoying the hunt and I'm learning a lot. Every one has been real helpful, I really appreciate all the time people have spent on searching for information on my ancestors.
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Richard Reise |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 14/02/2008 : 04:51:59
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Eibache
Where did you find the confirmation record for Halvor? I didn't actually have his confirmation record. I think what you all gave me before was a record of his moving into Rennesoy which told where he had been confirmed.
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Richard Reise |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 14/02/2008 : 05:09:13
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I apologize Eibache. I reread your previous post and see where you gave me a link for Halvor's confirmation record. I got confused and for some reason thought you gave me the confirmation record for Johannes Larsen. I got so excited about searching through the baptismal records that I forgot about the other two links,
Thank you for sighting all the records relating to the various grooms. If there is any relation to Halvor it is not readily apparent. I still find it interesting that Johannes Hoverstein was listed as the witness in so many weddings in such as a short period ot time. Actually you indicated he was the best man. Were their two best men for these weddings, it appears they have the names of two men listed.
Richard |
Richard Reise |
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eibache
Norway Heritage Veteran
Norway
6495 Posts |
Posted - 14/02/2008 : 08:14:22
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| Maybe "witness" should be used rather than "best man" although to my knowledge this is two expressions for the same purpose. (There were no "maids of honor" in the early years) |
Einar |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 14/02/2008 : 16:41:48
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Here in the United States in non-church weddings there is often times not a best man or maid of honor. This happens when people elope and don't invite any friends or relatives. But they still need two witnesses. In Las Vegas (where a lot of people elope to) wedding chapels the organist is often times one of the witnesses. I do know some people where the parents served as the witnesses. I imagine in most church ceremonies the witnesses are the best men and they are not likely to be the father. Maybe a brother but not usually the father. I have seen other Norwegian records where it specifically said best men, but that may be a matter of the translation. Johannes Jacobsen is probably not Halvor's brother unless he is a half-brother or step-brother. Thanks again for your help.
Richard |
Richard Reise |
Edited by - flukerkr on 14/02/2008 16:44:32 |
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hasto
Senior member
Norway
294 Posts |
Posted - 14/02/2008 : 21:34:15
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I guess the parents of Halvor were local tramps (not gypsies). The given name name Halvor indicates his parents were not local from Fjotland. The name is very common all over most of Norway, but not in Vest-Agder. Though In Sirdal, west of Fjotland, it was some used. Most common the name was in Telemark.
Fjotland is a parish, the northern part of Kvinesdal kommune. In 1801 Fjotland and Hægebostad were joined parishes, but not today. Hægebostad is in the next valley eastwards.
Halvor was born in Fjotland parish. |
Harald S Storaker
4586 Korshamn, Norge |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
Posted - 15/02/2008 : 01:01:53
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| Johannes Jacobsen Sokn (Sogn) had one half-brother, Ånen, who was born circa 1768 and died at the age of 13. Johannes was one of 8 children born in his father's second marriage and his mother's first. I've previously researched his family quite thoroughly and have never noticed any pattern of using the name Halvor in that particular branch of the ancestral line. |
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flukerkr
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 15/02/2008 : 05:03:07
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Thank you for the information Harald and Hopkins. Hopkins, can you tell me what year Johannes Jacobsen was born, i.e. was he the same age as my Halvor Johannessen or was he considerably older. Are Johannes Jacobsen Sokn and Johannes Jacobsen Hoverstein the same person
Given the fact that the name Halvor is not common in this area isn't there a good chance that the bride named Halvorsdatter on the page before Halvor Johannessen marriage might be related. Maybe Halvor's parents left him (abandoned) with some family relatives.
Richard |
Richard Reise |
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Topic |
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Locating Father of Halvor Johannesson
