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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
 Posted - 08/06/2016 : 02:38:05
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Hi, a photograph of Hansteens Gade 1, here - where Ludvig Christian Larsen lived. -link
Is Petra Johnson a name that appears on your grandfather's death record? (you wrote that Johnson is found on your grandfather's "gravesite information").
Are you guessing Johnson is a married name based on the death record?
Did your grandfather have contact with his birth mother? Would the informant on your grandfather's death record have a way of knowing who Petra married? |
Edited by - JaneC on 08/06/2016 17:38:43 |
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Hopkins
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3351 Posts |
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waukegan
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 02:45:13
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yes. My grandfather's Foster Family knew more than they shared. However yes, this is what I only recently observed on my Grandfathers information - when he was buried in !936. Looking on line.
It gave his Mother as Petia Johnson.
I know the family was pretty quiet about the whole ordeal. |
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waukegan
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 03:04:20
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So, that is to say --the Foster Family most assuredly put down that information about Christian's Mother.
They were in contact, and knew her. But very hushed about these things. But, once he'd died (at 39 years)
it would appear to me -- they put it down on his record -- but did not tell my Grandmother concerning her name change.
All that was ever told to me, was Petra Hansen. |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 05:51:07
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If you order a copy of the original of the death record you can find out who the informant was.
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The Petra in Trondheim in 1910 census was born 09 August 1868 in Solør, which matches the candidate Petra born 09 August 1868 in Hof in Solør, as found by eibache. |
Edited by - JaneC on 09/06/2016 11:50:33 |
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waukegan
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 17:24:48
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yes. thank you.
I will look into obtaining this needed proof.
However, I'm quite certain of what I understand.
thanks again! |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 17:42:44
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Better to formulate a hypothesis, which then suggests a course of action, and follow that course to prove or disprove the hypothesis. Being certain before the evidence is in is not a mind set you want to adopt, generally speaking, in any research endeavor.
Crossing fingers the death record will be helpful. |
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waukegan
Junior member
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 17:49:14
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that's just it.
No guarantee it will offer the name of the one whom had submitted the information.
But maybe they do that sort of thing.
I'll try giving the Cemetery a jingle.
Honestly. Then we'll have to prove they had actually been his Foster Parents?
(just thinking ahead)
thank you
Kind Regards
KAnnie
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2016 : 19:47:02
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Good for you, for going after Christian's death record.
The county where he died is where to send for a copy of the original death record. A death record asks for information about the deceased, for example, his birth date and parents' names. The doctor or coroner doesn't know personal information about the deceased. Someone has to supply the information. Usually the informant is a family member. In this case, we might expect the informant to be Christian's wife - but that was not necessarily the case. The name of the informant will be stated on the death record, because the death record won't assert facts about Christian without naming the source.
So yes, in fact, the name of the person who submitted the information WILL be listed.
To reassure you, the foster parents of Christian have already been established. They don't have to be proved.
I don't know if the cemetery has a copy of Christan's death record, but the official route to obtain it is through the county. |
Edited by - JaneC on 09/06/2016 23:14:51 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2016 : 14:03:16
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Don't recall if Kristian Larsen's emigration in 1907 was posted: link
Departing Kristiania (Oslo)
21.08.07
Selle Marie Anders. Snekkenes born 29.01.49 widow, handlende
Andrea Marie Snekkenes born 09.04.90
Kristian Johnsæter Lars.born 31.07.96
Residence: Fredriksstad
Destination: Ill (Illinois)
on the ship Oscar II
Selle Marie is listed as traveling to her child.
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If indeed the foster family had ongoing news about Petra over the years, then possibly - maybe - they were related to her. They might be key to solving the mystery.
So there's another hypothesis that could be investigated.
As Einar said before, he was 95% sure the candidate Petra is indeed the correct mother for Kristian, based on the corresponding identifiers. It's difficult in the circumstances to be 100% sure.
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If the Snekkenes family is related to the candidate Petra, that would support an even higher probability the candidate is correct.
Many times a mother's maiden name is misstated on a death record. That's so common that it's hard to know if "Petra Johnson" is just a mistake.
Yet it is striking that the candidate Petra did marry a Kristian Johnsen and used married name Petra Johnsen.
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Edited by - JaneC on 10/06/2016 15:32:38 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2016 : 15:45:29
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A description of the Snekkenes family here: link
In case link doesn't work: I searched on Google for "Andersen Snekkenes in Fredrikkstad." Got a hit for "Evangelisk tidende: the Norwegian-Danish Christian Advocate." 1920. Google books result
I don't read Norwegian, but just a little. I'll try to interpret. Seems to be an obituary for widow Mrs. Marie Snekkenes, born in Norway 29 January 1849, died in Waukegan, Illinois 28 May 1920.
Came from Fredrikkstad in 1907 to live with her daughter. (Survivors include?) Two daughters - Mrs. Antonia Purkins, Miss Andrea Marie Snekkenes, a foster son Christian Larsen and 6 stepchildren (?). Mrs. Julia Hansen, Mrs Anna Smith, Mrs Josephine Nilsen, Adolf and Kristian Snekkenes, all in America; and Christine Olsen in Norway. Two sisters in Fredrikkstad and a brother, Ole Andersen, of Superior, Wisconsin. Buried from her daughter's home....etc. Informant seems to be Mrs Antonia Purkins.
Emigration
Antonie Sofie Snekkenes, headed to Waukegan in 1906: link
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Edited by - JaneC on 10/06/2016 16:17:58 |
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jkmarler
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
7790 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2016 : 16:28:51
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At ellisisland.org Marie, Christian arrived as Snekkenes on Oscar II on 3 Sept 1907. Christan is assigned birthplace of Glemminge, Norway. They are going to Marie's daughter Anne Smith at Waukegon, Illinois.
Antonie was going to her brother-in-law George Nilsen at Waukegon. |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2016 : 16:30:42
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Here is Adolf Snekkenes, with Ole Snekkenes, and Anna Snekkenes, emigrating 1892 (KA, click Neste to see adjacent persons). link
Josefine Snekkenæs from Fr.stad born ca 1879 emigrating 1900:
link
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Selle Marie Anders. Snekkenes does not appear to be a woman in need of additional children.
I don't know anything of the foster care system in Fredrikkstad ca 1900, or whether caring for Christian could be a supplement to her income there. But clearly that's not the situation, when she takes him with her to America. Would be interesting to know when her husband died. Her youngest (seeming youngest) was born 1890. Six years later, when Christian was born, she steps in to mother him (or at least by the time of the 1900 census). In 1900 she's already a widow. Particularly if she "adopted" Christian after her husband's death, her willingness to have him has a vibe of family obligation - or at least possibly suggestive of that. Christian was only four in 1900, which eliminates another reason people took in foster children (free labor).
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Edited by - JaneC on 10/06/2016 17:11:00 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2016 : 17:55:58
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U.S. Naturalization Records, a birth date that matches Andrea Marie Snekkenes:
Andrea Marie SNAKNES
Born 09 April 1891 Norway
Arrival 1907
Naturaluzed 1927
Index only - |
Edited by - JaneC on 11/06/2016 13:11:41 |
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JaneC
Norway Heritage Veteran
USA
3020 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2016 : 18:10:22
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FAMILY TREE. link
Tree says Marie Andersen (Snekkenes) and her husband Andreas Christensen (1836-1890) lived for a time at....
BILET !!! |
Edited by - JaneC on 11/06/2016 13:15:40 |
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Family of Ludvig Larsen, Petra Hansen, Bilet
